There is no CableCARD 2.0

With the July 1st CableCARD mandate right around the corner, we have really wanted to know how the cable companies are going to continue to provide VOD -- and other bi-directional services -- without CableCARD 2.0. Thanks to our friend Mari over at ConnectedHome2Go, we got to spend some time with Mark DePietro, the Vice President of Strategy of Motorola Home and Networks Mobility, and he filled us in on some details about CableCARDs. The most shocking thing we learned was: there is no such thing as a CableCARD 2.0 -- it's a standard, not a physical device.

Currently 3rd party CableCARD devices hosts can't get certified by CableLabs for bi-directional (CC 2.0) uses, but it isn't the hardware that is holding up the works, but the standard. The CEA and NCTA just can't come to an agreement about what should be required for bi-directional certification. According to Mark, the reason is complicated, and his understanding is that it has a lot to do with OCAP. If we had to guess, we'd say that the CEA is on our side, but honestly we just don't know. Until this happens, it means no VOD or SDV for CableCARD host devices -- like the TiVo Series3.

On July 1st, 2007, cable companies all over the US will deploy bi-directional capable CableCARD host devices. They will use the same CableCARDs that are available to everyone, and they will support bi-directional services. These cards -- which are already in the wild -- are also multi-stream cards (M-Card), which means that dual tuner DVRs will only require a single card to authorize content for both tuners. The TiVo Series3 has an M-Card slot (slot 1), but the software isn't there to support it, and Mark's colleague Greg is under the impression that TiVo will be updating the Series3 to resolve this very soon. While it would be nice for Series3 owners to only need one CableCARD, this still will not enable the bi-directional functionality of the card because the Series3 hardware just isn't equipped. TiVo is working to find a solution, but we will just have to wait and see how it turns out.

One of the other questions we had for Mark, is why are there are so many problems with CableCARDs? He said that Motorola has done a lot to help make them work; not only have they worked with CE manufactures to work out the bugs, but they have even sold head-ends and CableCARDs so they could set up their own labs. In the end it seems that most manufactures have stopped shipping TVs with CableCARD slots, and while no one really seems to know why; we still think it's to reduce the number of customer support calls caused from the cable companies blaming the manufacturer for all the problems. We don't know about anyone elses experience, but in ours, we can tell you that the cable company did whatever it could to convince us not to use a CableCARD.

One thing is for sure, the FCC isn't ready to give up on the OpenCable dream just yet; let's just hope they intervene and get bi-directional CableCARD host support for everyone sooner, rather than later.

[(Unverified) Posted Jun 15th 2007 11:56AM]

I have been using a cablecard for about 2 months now and i love it. I do miss the on screen guide but the picture quality is so much better than through a stb with hdmi. comcast had no idea how to get it to work though when i called to have them set it up. It took them about ten minutes of studying to figure it out. i guess that they dont do many of them.

[relayer926 Posted Jun 15th 2007 1:55PM]

Matt - I got a Comcast CableCard a couple of months ago too. I had to show the tech how to do it! Kinda makes me wonder why they make you schedule service instead of just picking it up...

[(Unverified) Posted Jun 15th 2007 1:57PM]

I use my Series 3 over-the-air, but If I went to cable it would be a no-brainer to use cable card. VOD doesn't bother me so much (I've got netflix for a reason), and the Series 3 provides an on-screen guide. If I ever do go to cable, I've got the installation instructions from the Tivo in a drawer just in case.

[davezatz Posted Jun 15th 2007 1:51PM]

The distinction between *bi-directional* and *multistream* needs to be reinforced - also a distinction should be reinforced between what the cable-cos can provide versus what CE companies like TiVo can provide. CE companies are still getting the short-end...

[(Unverified) Posted Jun 15th 2007 9:40PM]

The reason that bi-directional communication works on the Motorola and Scientific Atlanta boxes is because they are OCAP compliant.

In order to be OCAP compliant, TiVo would have to cede control of their user interface over to the cable companies and they justifiably aren't interested in doing so.

[(Unverified) Posted Jun 15th 2007 2:32PM]

So what's the benefit of CableCARD 2.0 over bidirectional M CableCARD?

[BenD Posted Jun 15th 2007 2:34PM]

Henning,
There is no difference, they are one in the same.

The cable companies don't want to let the CE play cause they can't control the software.

[jbish Posted Jun 15th 2007 2:36PM]

So does this mean current DCTs could possibly be upgraded via firmware to be compatible with SDV?

[BenD Posted Jun 15th 2007 2:37PM]

It depends on the hardware. But it may be possible.

[Fanfoot Posted Jun 15th 2007 4:05PM]

1) The STBs that will be shipping after 7/7 with cable cards in them may be OCAP compliant, but they generally won't be running OCAP if they are installed right now. Most cable systems are set up for OCAP yet. Yet strangely, they'll still be able to handle VOD and they'll still get the guide. How is this possible? Its because they're cable boxes, and run middleware that is written pretty much the same as it always was. It just uses the cable card to do the decrypting.

2) Yes of course all those MOT DCT STBs will work with SDV. You just need bidirectional communication, which these boxes are entirely capable of. There's no standard that a CE device can write to, but in a given system there's methods of doing it. You won't need an OCAP capable box to do SDV--Time Warner has been testing SDV for some time, and they generally just roll it out in a region. They don't make everybody hand their STBs back in. If they did, the switch to SDV might well be cost prohibitive.

[7r1ck13 Posted Jun 15th 2007 10:03PM]

You are correct Glenn.. Gold Star for you..

Im currently testing a Samsung HD-STB, and we are currently running OCAP on it with our new guide system.. The boxes are really flakey right now but Im sure with a few updates it'll be fine.. We are already talkin about droping the OCAP software til it works beter..

And VOD/2way services are running just fine on the box.. Also to note.. This Samsung box is one that the subscriber will be able to buy Retail..

[(Unverified) Posted Jun 15th 2007 4:41PM]

Why are we enabling this crappy company (Cable Labs) to continue? They do not have the consumers interests in mind.

[BenD Posted Jun 15th 2007 4:43PM]

CableLabs is owned by a consortment of Cable Companies, so of course they don't have the consumer in mind, but instead themselves.

It was created, so that the cable co's could work together to meet the FCC mandates, but they are dragging their feet every step of the way.

[(Unverified) Posted Jun 15th 2007 5:32PM]

I can understand why there is so much confusion when people like Mike F. muddy things by spreading misinformation. The reason that bi-directional communication works with the new NPH (non-portable host) set tops has NOTHING to do with the fact that they are capable of running in an OCAP environment. They continue to function in a bi-directional manner because the box still has a dedicated Upstream Modem for its QPSK return messaging to the RPD2000, and DAC6000, receiver and controller (in a Motorola environment).

In addition, the notion of TiVo having to "cede control of their user interface" to become OCAP compliant, is complete rubbish, and not even worth getting into.

All in all, you clearly have little insight into the intent and implementation of the OCAP environment or the inner workings of CableLabs. I suggest you keep all this nonsense to yourself and stop pretending like you know what you're talking about...honestly CableLabs has done a great job at making it confusing enough as it is.

cableric

[(Unverified) Posted Jun 15th 2007 8:21PM]

This is all too complicated. Just sell me a dam High Def. DVR so I don't have to continue renting from Time Warmer.

[(Unverified) Posted Jun 16th 2007 4:08PM]

Hi Ben,

It may also be worth noting that the cablecard itself can work in both uni- and bi-directional idtvs or set top boxes; meaning the cablecard does not provide the two way functionality. All it does is allow the idtv or set top box to decode the digital video. 'Bidirectional cablecard' is a bit of a misleading term.

[BenD Posted Jun 15th 2007 10:30PM]

Ron,
Thanks for the clarification, I added a few instances of the word "host" in attempt to clear that up.

It gets confusing without the word host because it's hard to diferciate between the CableCARD itself and the CableCARD host.

[AR Posted Jun 15th 2007 11:22PM]

My neiborhood recently got FiOS with cable TV. I called Verizon to ask about the cost of cable cards. The sales person initially said, "we don't offer those." Then, after protracted holding, he returned to tell me that they had no information on cost. Definitely...cable cards are discouraged by cable companies.

[(Unverified) Posted Jun 18th 2007 8:51PM]

Eric,

You are correct that instead of saying the Motorola and Scientific Atlanta boxes have 2-way communication because they are OCAP compliant I should have said that they have cable company middleware, but I stand by the fact that the only way a 3rd party box like TiVO can have 2-way communication is if it is OCAP compliant.

I believe that Ben just created a new post that confirms my statements.

http://www.engadgethd.com/2007/06/18/cablecard-2-0-whats-the-hold-up/