http://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/ Engadget HD Comments for CE-Oh no he didn't! Part XI: Stringer's flip-flop edition http://hd.engadget.com/media/feedlogo.gif http://hd.engadget.com en-us Copyright 2009 Weblogs, Inc. The contents of this feed are available for non-commercial use only. Blogsmith http://www.blogsmith.com/http://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/http://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/Nov 22nd 2007 10:02AMhttp://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/http://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/
This is akin to the Toshiba exec a few months ago who said that Microsoft did not want to "limit" the 360 by adding in an internal HD DVD drive. Sometimes you just have to take these people's statements with a grain of salt.]]>Nov 22nd 2007 10:04AMhttp://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/http://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/
Conveniently enough, the same place I found the A3 selling for $160 was also selling a Blu-ray player for $340. Thus, one can get entry into both formats via standalone solutions for $500. And if one has a robust HTPC and the luck to find the LG combo drive, the combined solution could be had for $300.]]>Nov 22nd 2007 10:12AMhttp://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/http://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/
No flip flop there.

This isn't even accurate as BD continues to outsell HDVD, so perhaps it's the sudden influx of $99 HDVD players he's comparing to. The numbers for the last several weeks, for those who don't pay attention: NOV 11 65%Blu 35%HDVD, Nov 71%Blu 29%HDVD, Oct 28 55%Blu 45%HDVD, October 21 51%Blu 49%HDVD (transformers release), Oct 14 71%Blu 29%HDVD, October 7 68%Blu 32%HDVD.

In the meantime, the year to date and since inception numbers have stayed locked in the area of 65-35 and 61-39 respecively. Also, let's remember that HDVD got started before Blu-Ray so for them to have 39% share, they have LOST a huge share of the market. Unless HDVD manages to battle back to %50 or more on a consistent basis, I don't see any hope for them, or any reason why studios would continue to bother (other than all that cash they were given).

Frankly I saw nothing in his original comments or the new article, which you didn't link to: http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/hr/content_display/home_entertainment/video/e3ie3ee16106869ea720bef9b3771c93cf1
That I see as anything more than BD saying 'if you want to end this before you go broke, we can work something out'. He said straight out in the original article that he wasn't around when they tried to unify the formats originally, and he wished that he could go back and put more effort into it. Since all the HDVD loonies decided to make fun of him wanting to time travel or something, no one heard him offering to save toshiba from their sinking ship. Tell me, if you were loosing $200 on every player you were making, wouldn't you be listening for a way out of it? 'We're at a stalemate for the moments, you're in your best negotiating position that you'll ever be in, if you want to try again to unify the formats before you go broke, let me know...'. It'd be worth the effort for BD to get universal and paramount back more immediately, and toshiba could use a stabilization of the market in the WORST way. ]]>Nov 22nd 2007 12:48PMhttp://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/http://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/Nov 22nd 2007 8:45PMhttp://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/http://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/Nov 23rd 2007 7:12PMhttp://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/http://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/The "Stalemate" interview has been released in its entirety and it has been cleared that Mr Stringer's comments were taken out of context by the AP jounralist in an effort to have a nice title for his/her article.
So now when I see "maybe he'll be singing a different tune next week" and that you portray him squarely as a "Flip Flopper", I gotta wonder where your heads are?

link: http://www.thedigitalbits.com/mytwocentsa146.html
scroll down to the 11/12/07 date]]>Nov 23rd 2007 12:14AMhttp://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/http://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/Nov 23rd 2007 1:01AMhttp://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/http://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/
From the people that have been telling us all year that 'we already won' we now get one of their senior execs saying "We ave a sort of stalemate at the moment".

Yeah, nothing to see here. Move along people.

The truth is that if Stringer is prepared to publiclt admit this much (even if he has now started to contradict & try to spin his way out of it) you can bet that (with their rep for lying BS PR throughout this so-called 'war') the truth is much much worse for Blu-ray.

My bet is he already knows Warner are within a couple of months of dumping Blu-ray (just like Paramount did) and they have not been able to pursuade them to change their minds. ]]>Nov 23rd 2007 2:00PMhttp://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/http://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/
Yet again, Blu Ray is scoring a 66:34 win for last week (nielsen), which is every single week since Jan 1 2007.
On a week where Blu Ray had no major release (week after Ratatouille and before Die Hard 4), HD DVD had Shrek3 AND a Bogo, and the effect of the 90k A2 sold had to be felt... 66:34, more than the ratio on Rat's week.

Excuse me, I have to laugh hard here, specially if you think Warner is going to drop Blu Ray :)
Oh, check also this link about th situation in Japan, indicative of what 's happening in the rest of the world:

http://www.tech.co.uk/home-entertainment/high-definition/news/blu-ray-wins-97-per-cent-of-hd-recorder-sales?articleid=955163990&zoom=true&page=1

and

http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2007/11/23/bd_dominates_japan_hd_r_sales/

The Us is the last place where there is even a battle, even if a constant 2:1 battle is a bit of a constant loss, don;t you think ? :)]]>Nov 23rd 2007 5:53PMhttp://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/http://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/Everytime.

The truth is the 'war' is being decided in the USA (although Japan may just go it alone - Sony did after-all cling on to the dead Betamax format there until 2002).

Stringer's comments didn't just come from nowhere.

.....and there is absolutely zero reason to expect that what Paramount said (in relation to Blu-ray's additional costs taking away much of the net effect/profitability of those supposed additional sales) is unique to them alone.

I wouldn't be so cocky about Warner if I was a Blu-ray fan right now. ]]>Nov 23rd 2007 8:59PMhttp://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/http://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/Nov 24th 2007 7:48AMhttp://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/http://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/
Some people look forward to a time when format is irrelevant (often suggestinf the DVD -R & DVD +R 'battle' as a template).

Unfortunately for Blu-ray such a situation would provide everyone with an HD DVD player in their dual format player and all 'the industry' with good reason to switch permanently to HD DVD with it being the cheapest format to produce
(and therefore the most profitable to them).

Blu-ray production requires new plant/lines, HD DVD does not.
Blu-ray have 2 reliable plants producing their DL discs compared to around 150 DVD lines capable of moving to HD DVD production with ease and very cheaply.

Dual format players are as big a threat to Blu-ray as anything, it's why they hate the idea of them.

Blu-ray failed to know HD DVD quickly out of the game, now (as HD DVD just grows and grows) it's only a matter of time.

Their almost total reliance on the PS3 was also an understandable but grave error. ]]>Nov 24th 2007 9:58AMhttp://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/http://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/
often 'suggestinf' the DVD -R & DVD +R 'battle' - should have been 'suggesting'

and

Blu-ray failed to 'know' HD DVD quickly out of the game - should have been 'knock' ]]>Nov 24th 2007 2:17PMhttp://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/http://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/Not only Blu has knowcked HD DVD of a leader position, but they have constantly oustold HD DVD software -despite having higher priced (for better quality) players-, and thus by a constant 2:1 or hgher margin on an expanding market.

Other tihng that "Truth" fails to recognize (but we are used to the FUD spread by HD DVD fanboys at this point), is that the market is growing, and yet HD DVD fails as well to mtake a lead despite literally giving its players away (players at $98 and $169 with 5+ movies), and buying out a Movie studio for $150M which gave the format its only shots at taking a lead in 2007 for even a week.

Guess what? It again failed to do so.

The war is over in the rest of the world, and the US might see a little presence of HD DVDs for a while. Like the Betamax in its time...]]>Nov 24th 2007 8:59PMhttp://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/http://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/
The US market is tiny everywhere else it is practically invisible (which is why the Blu-ray supporters avoid talking actual numbers sold like the plague and stick to more impressive sound - but empty - ratios and percentages).

Despite having between 10 - 20 times the number of Blu-ray capable players out there they have only managed a 60:40 lead.
That's laughably pathetic......and everyone in the business can see it.

Blu-ray got an entirely predictable lead because it was grafted onto the PS3, that's all.
No big deal and wholly expected (even if it is a disaster in it's own market).
The problem is that a mere kiddies game console can never win in the adult a/v market
(which dwarfs the game console market by a huge margin btw).

Hence Stringers admissions lately (even if they did try and row back some).

Paramount were right tho, big Q4 sales for HD DVD coupled with HD DVD's cost advantages will see this work through eventually.

2008 is going to be one very interesting year, especially Jan when Warner make their announcement at CES.
I'm really looking forward to seeing what excuses the Blu-crew come out with after they go HD DVD exclusive.

(and after Disney voting for 51gb TL HD DVD discs - and not just abstaining as BDA members on the DVD Forum usually do - it may well be that they are set to bail after a suitable period of neutrality too) ]]>Nov 24th 2007 9:39PMhttp://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/http://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/
Now you can laugh all you want about the "Blu Ray capable player" for PS3, as usual, the HD DVD fanboys use that argument (the laughable "attachment rate" when it suits them, but shy away when we actually calculate the number of Blu Ray players implied). I'll let you do the math with 20% (at worst) PS3 as Blu Ray players, with more than 5 Million consoles as of October. One more reason to go Blu Ray :)
Oh and I'll remind you that in september Blu Ray even took the lead in sales of Standalones, despite being more expensive (again, quality is recognized by many people).

Despite 100k (supposedly) HD DVD players sold in November at the pathetic price of $98 (visibly desperate to do a sale), it hasn't made a dent in the sales ratio. In fact, the ratio has improved for Blu Ray ! From 65:35 last week to 66:34 this week (wihtout any big release or Bogo sale on Blu Ray, while Shrek3 and a bogo were going on for Toshiba!) !

Last, as per Warner going Blu Ray or HD DVD, I won't make any pronostics. Let's just say that some people, who are way better informed than you are, have stated that they -know- that Warner will still produce Blu Ray discs in 2008.
And if they indeed anounce taking side at the CES, we know what it means :) (seems logical after all, given that they sell more Warner discs on Blu Ray than HD DVD. Cf 300).

So, If anything happens at the CES for Blu, I'll remember to come back here and put your nose into it :)]]>Nov 25th 2007 1:00AMhttp://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/http://hd.engadget.com/2007/11/22/ce-oh-no-he-didnt-part-xi-stringers-flip-flop-edition/
The point with Disney is that they could have abstained in the DVD Forum vote (which is afterall the usual behaviour of the BDA members that sit on the DVD Forum - after they were publicly shamed & exposed for abusing their voting position when the tried to block HD DVD development).

Disney did not abstain.

Disney actively voted 'for' the 51gb TL HD DVD discs.

Ignore that if you like or write it off as of no consequence all you like, we shall see.

I do note that the 'embarrassing idiot children' on Blu-ray.com have already decided it'll still all be ok for Blu-ray even if Disney & Warner leave.....as far as their game consoles go it will be, of course, they'll still need it to pump games out with and like UMD there'll still be a market of millions to sell to.

But true to type in this you prefer to just ignore what has been said about the additional costs Blu-ray imposes on producers (not forgetting the tiny reliable production facilities) and fixate on the initial sales numbers
(which do not look that great for Blu-ray, actually).

Blu-ray is PS3.
Unfortunately for Blu-ray PS3 just doesn't move enough movies (and right now is the high-point; sooner or later they have got to get some decent games out on it, eh? :P ).

BTW that's actually just pure typical Blu-ray propaganda BS about Blu-ray ever holding a lead in stand-alone sales.

The fact that HD DVD players (HD A2 & HD A3) have been the best selling DVD player - period, not just best selling high def player - for well over 6 months speaks volumes.
One Blu-ray player, the Samsung BDP 1400, has recently broken into the Amazon top 10 only in the last 2 weeks.
Previous to that it had been the only one in their top 25 for months (with short periods of the Sony S300 joining it at the bottom of their top 25) speaks volumes about what is really going on with stand-alones.

But great, you claim 'inside' knowledge of what is going to happen with Warner and want to vaguely imply you 'know' if they call it will be to 'your side (Blu-ray) and I have spoken to several (trusted) sources who tell me the deal was done some time ago actually and they will be going HD DVD exclusive in 2008.
I expect an announcement at CES in Jan.

We shall see. ]]>Nov 25th 2007 9:11AM