Ask Engadget HD: What's the ultimate HD movie HTPC setup?
By Ben Drawbaugh 
posted Jan 16th 2008 10:52AM
posted Jan 16th 2008 10:52AM
We love HD movies, but we also love HTPCs, and bringing the two together would make us very happy. But the problem is we demand the ultimate experience -- or at least the best we out there. While it seems the best solution is yet to come, we wonder how close it is to being a reality on a HTPC, so the question this week is.What's the ultimate HD movie HTPC setup and what are the advantages and drawbacks over stand-alone players. Obviously a fast processor and video card are necessary, but which ones? What is the best video card and does it provide HDMI (1.2 or 1.3?). What is the best playback software, WinDVD or PowerDVD? And do they work with Windows Media Center? Which is the best HD media drive, does it support both formats? Can we enjoy any, or all of the next-gen audio codecs, if so how? Do OEMs offer the best solutions, or is the DIY route the only way to go? We want to know it all and we want to know why. So stop holding back and let us know.
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To record HD content via my cable co. is it true I need an OEM approved PC?
Are DVD's really upscaled to 1080i or better when using HTPCs?
I've been looking at the GIGABYTE GA-EP35-DS4 mobo for it's DTS Connect functions because I thought I needed DTS to get 5.1 audio. It seems this is not the case. This mobo cost is $170+ ;(.
Please add the Pros/Cons of the various types of cable connections. VGA/DVI/component/HDMI, etc.
Well, I'll start. I just bought an LG GGW-H20L combo Blu-ray Burner and HD DVD rom, which to me is the best option for those that want to put a foot firmly in the Blu-ray camp but still be able to watch HD DVDs. I also have a (HTCP compliant) 1080p Epson LCD projector and an Asus EN8600GT Silent video card that is suppose to be HDCP compliant, but has dual DVI output (didn't think HDCP and DVI went together).
Software I use is AnyDVD and PowerDVD Ultra (v7.3.3319a which lets me play Blu-ray and HD DVDs from my Hard Drive). I don't have the latest receiver with HDMI inputs so I'm still using SPDIF output so the latest generation audio is down sampled to optimal DTS. My receiver is an old Onkyo THX and speakers are KRIX. This is not the ultimate setup but just a first step into the Blu-ray/HD DVD waters.
I'm also curious about the best way to connect the video card to the TV. I made sure to buy my TV with a VGA port and I've been looking into a combination HTPC and gaming rig. ("Battlefield 2142" on a 47" TV with 5.1 surround? Rowrrrr!!!) But is there likely to be an HDCP problem because of connecting via VGA instead of HDMI?
As for corporate-built vs. DIY, I'm strictly a DIY person for one main reason -- warranty, especially with hard drives. Yes, I'm sure that the boys like Dell and HP are oh-so-very-happy to sell you a multi-hundred-dollar, extended warranty on top of their standard 1 year warranty; but if I buy drives from NewEgg, especially Seagate, I get a 5 year warranty. Additionally, many video cards now have a lifetime warranty, but not if you buy an OEM PC.
Plus, my experience with OEMs is that they actually expect to send the whole unit back for "problem determination" even if you know that the optical drive died unless you pay a lot more for on-site service. (This is a long story in itself, but swore me away from HP PCs.) At least with DIY you can upgrade and do whatever you want without regard to keeping track of an OEM computer's original configuration if you need warranty work.
Yeah, DIY can cost more in the here-and-now, but I think the long-term benefits to it outweigh an OEM PC.
I wrote this some time ago, should help you get things connected. But when it was written there were no HDMI enabled video cards, so not sure what to tell you there.
I checked on NewEgg and some of the "basic" video cards with HDMI start at around $99. Being a gamer I'd need something a bit beefier. They were around $149 for something close to what I'd use.
I'm not too worried about HDMI/HDCP to the receiver because the connection from the TV to the receiver is optical and the TV behaves as an audio switch, which is REALLY nice. No HDCP issues from my HD DVD player, and hopefully none whenever I get my PS3. Any issues from a PC can be ... er ... rectified.
Actually, that's another issue. If the HDMI port is on the video card, how are audio signals sent?
Here's my setup:
Processor - AMD Athlon 64 X2 5600+ Windsor @ 2.8GHz ($139.99 on Newegg)
TV Tuner - HauppaugeWinTV-PVR 500 ($139.99 on Newegg). 2 Tuners so my girlfriend can watch Grey's while I record The Office even though they are in the same time slot. You could also add another card and have 4 tuners, although I'm not sure what the limit on Windows Media Center is.
Optical Drive - LG GGC-H20L Blu-Ray/HD-DVD/DVD/CD Drive. Don't care to bother with the format war? This drive is only $299.99 on Newegg and can play back both formats.
Video Card - ATI Radeon HD 2600XT ($114.99 on Newegg). This card offers full hardware offloading for VC-1 and H.264 (aka the Codecs HD-DVD and Blu-Ray use to compress their movies) so you won't kill your processor trying to play back HD content. Although the card has a DVI output, it comes with a DVI->HDMI adapter that will allow you to send sound out through the video card to the HDMI port of your TV or receiver. The sound is only 5.1, so those of your looking for the ultimate experience will still want to get a third-party audio card capable of doing DTS-HD or TrueHD. It is also HDCP compliant.
HD-DVD/Blu-Ray Playback Software - Cyberlink PowerDVD Ultra ($99.95) with AnyDVD HD (79 euros, $116.19 at the current exchange rate). I've heard that some people have had problems with this software, but I personally have not. It allows hardware acceleration with my graphics card and plays back smoothly. I don't typically use the extra features on the discs so I can't speak for its Web Content and other advanced functionality. AnyDVD HD comes in handy mostly when one component in your system isn't HDCP compliant. It removes the encryption from HD-DVD and Blu-Ray titles on the fly so you don't need HDCP to play them back. This also allows you to rip them to your hard drive and play them back on any computer which also has PowerDVD Ultra and AnyDVD HD. While my setup is HDCP compliant I still sometimes find it difficult to playback HD-DVD and Blu-ray titles without it turned on, but I'm yet to find out why.
OS - Windows Vista Home Premium ($109.99 for System Builder's License on Newegg)
Memory - 2GB PC2 6400 (price varies)
Hard Drive Space - 1TB (price varies). Storage is a huge part of any HTPC, especially if you want to digitize your entire movie collection. If I were to build a new setup today (and I could afford it) I would set up a file server or a NAS to store all of this. Attach it to a gigabit network and share all of it and you've got a completely disconnected place to store all your media.
Then don't forget your motherboard, case and power supply and you're good to go.
I saw somebody ask the pros/cons of the various cable connections, here's what I can think of
VGA - Pros - Higher resolutions than DVI in some cases
Cons - tends to crush colors, doesn't provide very good color range without customization. Some TVs don't have this connection. Analog signal, so it can be interfered with.
DVI - Pros - All digital signal to eliminate interference.
Cons - Many newer TV models lack a straight DVI connector. Too many connector variations (DVI-I, DVI-D etc.). Effectively obsoleted by HDMI.
Component - Pros - Cheap cables, good image quality for an analog signal. It is currently the standard analog medium for HD content.
Cons - Open to interference. Not many video cards offer Component out.
HDMI - Pros - Digital audio and video on the same cable, so no interference.
Cons - HDMI receivers are still expensive and so are the cables. HDMI versions can be confusing.
I you get the very latest version (Beta) of a program called AnyDVD HD it should eliminate any HDCP issues.
http://www.slysoft.com/en/anydvdhd.html
I've simply got my MacBook Pro hooked up to my 46" Sharp Aquos 1080p set with a DVI to HDMI cable. Sound goes through an optical cable to my receiver. Lets me play all my downloaded and web content on my big screen. No surround sound though, since I'm too lazy to hook up the speakers.
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=8649368&type=product&id=1195599475576
is a computer we sell at work and it is amazing specs and great player for HTPC...
what i have is a little different but works WONDERS with HD video.... even the default graphics card built in with DVI is great for HTPC
Processor Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Quad CPU Q6700 @ 2.66GHz 5.9
Memory (RAM) 3.92 GB 5.7
Graphics Intel(R) G33/G31 Express Chipset Family 3.9
Gaming graphics 286 MB Total available graphics memory 3.2
Primary hard disk 99GB Free (233GB Total) 5.3
Windows Vista (TM) Ultimate
System
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Manufacturer INTEL_
Model DG33TL__
Total amount of system memory 3.93 GB RAM
System type 64-bit operating system
Number of processor cores 4
Storage
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Total size of hard disk(s) 233 GB
Disk partition (C:) 99 GB Free (233 GB Total)
Media drive (D:) CD/DVD
Media drive (H:) CD/DVDCD/DVD
Media drive (I:) CD/DVDCD/DVDCD/DVD
Graphics
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Display adapter type Intel(R) G33/G31 Express Chipset Family
Total available graphics memory 286 MB
Dedicated graphics memory 0 MB
Dedicated system memory 128 MB
Shared system memory 158 MB
Display adapter driver version 7.14.10.1350
Primary monitor resolution 1280x720
DirectX version DirectX 9.0 or better
Network
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Network Adapter Intel(R) 82566DC-2 Gigabit Network Connection
Network Adapter Microsoft Tun Miniport Adapter
Network Adapter Virtual Machine Network Services Driver
and i agree with the cable connections pros/cons matt did
btw the numbers next to the lines are the vista ratings
For a HTPC, I like the HP Pavilion Slimline s3300. Small. Quiet. Combo drive. Optional ASTC tuner.
The downside of an HTPC is that PowerDVD downsamples the HD audio.
Let me say that my ultimate HDPC is still work in progress but here is what I have so far:
- Dell XPS 420
- Vista Home Premium with Cable Card support
- I just received two ATI TV Wonder digital Cable Tuner boxes in the mail today (delayed shipment seperate from the XPS PC directly from ATI)
- I will be getting two Cox Communications cable cards later today.
- 1 TB Seagate HD dedicated to Win Media Center recordings.
- Nvidea GeForce 8500 GTS video card with HMDI out in addition to a DVI out. I added this card to the XPS fron an older HP media center PC as Dell did not offer an HDMI out video card.
- So far I have the on-board audio that came with the XPS (that may need to change).
- LG Blu-ray read/right HD-DVD ROM disk drive.
I have two immediate improvement objectives:
1) get the new cable tuner boxes to work with Cox HD/digital channels. The analog SD recording just ain't cutting it for me anymore. I hear this can be challenging given that Cox has stated to me that though they are happy to rent me the 2 cable cards, they will not give me tech support unless I put them into TVs. It sounds like me and Dell are on our own for the install?
2) Get audio pumping into my video card and out thru an HDMI cable into my 52" Sharp HDTV. This has been a challenge as the Dell does not have an on-board digital audio output jack that the jump cables my video card came with can plug into. My old HP on-board audio had that but not the Dell. At the moment I need to play audio through my Sony receiver, which I do for HD DVD movies anyway but usually not for my wife (technophobe) watching her soap operas. I figure I need a new sound card but I have yet to find one that has the style of onboard audio out connector that my video card requires. Any suggestions out there?
I have an HP running MCE 2005 hooked up through my Xbox.
P4 2.8
1.5 GM RAM.
Nvidia GeForce 6600OC video card, 256MB.
Also a Hauppauge PVR 1600 running cable and an OTA antenna.
Anyone that can help me figure out how to get QAM channels with that card it would be greatly appreciated. I realize Media Center won't do QAM but I can't get them through the WinTV apps either.
Another con to HDMI that I haven't seen discussed yet is the HDMI handshake and EDID transmission to an HTPC. I currently have a Geforce 6150LE IGP connected to via DVI->HDMI connector to the TV. If the PC turns on w/o the TV on, like for a recording, it doesn't detect the TV and doesn't turn on the DVI port. I need to switch to the VGA port and reenable the DVI port. It's gotten to the point where I just use VGA now.
It could be a driver issue on Nvidia's side but I see some ATI users with the same probelm. Only solution I found is to use Gefen's DVI Detective to continuously transmit the EDID.
I built my own and it worked out great! :) I feel if you can afford it and have the time to build it yourself or the money to buy one premade it is the best way to go. I figure you get a motherboard GPU and processor in every HD player you buy or game console, why not do it all on one? A lot of games are ported or (like Crysis) PC exclusive or when they go PC they are better like Gears of War and offer modability and addon functionality. Games are more friendly to customization and have been for some time these days. It's a fun experience and much more fault tolerant. It's easier to replace one bad card than my whole player and cheaper too you know? You can upgrade easier too. I wouldn't have it any other way and most of my HD source is from my HTPC. To give an idea if you build smart and do it yourself I saved about $1000 building mine and timing my purchases correctly. There's no saying you cant still get the game consoles and plug them into your TV as well for those exclusive games you really like and if you have dual displays soft modding the XBOX to store like an Apple TV to run your TV instead and installing a bigger hard drive in it is great too. This way one can free up system resources for other functions or the intensive games and watch a movie at the same time or background noise. Sorry about the run-on but it's pretty exciting of a concept.
Double Post warning, Specs are here: http://www.overclock.net/system.php?i=14213
and photos are here: http://www.overclock.net/gallery/showgallery.php/cat/500/ppuser/40875
CPU: AMD Athlon 64 X2 3800+ @ 2.0GHz
Motherboard: ECS NF-MCP61
Bios: Award BIOS
GPU maker: nvidia
Graphics Card: BFG GeForce 8800GT 512MB OC
Memory: 2 x Corsair 1GB PC2-5300 DDR2 667 MHz
Hard Drive: 120GB Main + 500GB ATA + 3 x 500GB SATA
Optical Drive: Sony AW-G170A
Power Supply: 700 Watt PS2 ATX 12V
Display: Samsung Synchmaster 22" 2232BW and Sharp LC-42D64U
Case: RAIDMAXxA
Sound Card: Creative Labs Sound Blaster X-fi Extreme Audio 7.1
Speakers: Logitech X-540
Headphones: Logitech ClearChat Pro USB Headset
Mouse: xRaider Mouse
Mouse pad: Flexiglow FX Game Pad
Keyboard: Logitech G15 Gaming Keyboard
Operating System: Windows XP Professional
Anyone successfully getting HD Audio (DD+, TrueHD or DTS-MA) out of their HTPC? Any suggestions for equipment that will support this?
Here's what I did to get HD audio out from my HTPC.
-I connected an optical/toslink cable from my motherboard's optical audio output to my receiver's optical input.
-I used three 3.5mm-to-dual RCA cables (I got these from Micro Center) from my motherboard's analog outputs to my receiver's multi channel inputs.
-When I want DD+ or DTS 5.1 I set the audio out in PowerDVD to "Use SPDIF" and set my receiver to the optical input.
-For TrueHD, DTS-MA, and PCM I set the audio out in PowerDVD to "6 speaker" and set my receiver to the multi channel input.
No need for a htpc.
Pioneer Kuro Elite HMG
and PS3
My Stats - DIY Vista Media Center PC (VMC)
Core 2 Duo 6320
2 Gig 6400
LG Combo Drive HD DVD Blu Ray (recently purchased)
Radeon 1950pro (256mb) w/ HCDP, no HDMI (use DVI to HDMI dongle), use VGA for playback though
My experience is good. Upgraded from the XBOX HDDVD drive to the the LG Combo drive. Because the 1950 doesn't have good HW accelerataion for HD material, I occasionaly skip frames on some content. Upgrading to a gc with HD hw acceleration. Don't use AnyDVD. PowerDVD for playback. Gigabyte mobo with on board audio in pass through so no advanced audio (i.e. no dolby trueHD). Even though I have DVI (DVI-2-HDMI) plugged in, I mostly use vga. Never had any problems with VGA. In the radeon menu I have to enable one (1) monitor for HD DVD playback. HTPC was the best move for me. I added about $650 of equipment to get old P4 system to current system. Well worth it, considering I still get HD (OTA) and cable DVR, My Movies (STD DVD libary), etc. In fact, if you have a older system I would recommend upgrading graphics card, getting Power DVD and combo drive and you should be OK. Either way HTPC is the way to go.
The perfect solution does not exist yet, but its getting there.
The new Intel G35 motherboard chipset supports 7.1 LPCM audio over HDMI. That with an LG BD/HDDVD drive and a Q6600 CPU and you're all set. You get full 1080p video with HD sound and no stuttering.
I just have my MacBook hooked up via DVI and optical digital audio. I can play downloaded HD content, have 2TB worth of hard drives hooked up, and could even add an external Blu-ray drive if I wanted to (but I have a PS3 too, so that's unnecessary). A home theater computer allows me to easliy display family pictures and play video games on my HDTV.
Best of all, though, when my wife needs to use a laptop and mine is busy, she can just unplug a few cords and the MacBook is good to go with it's 4-hour battery :)
Took forever to figure out what worked well at a decent price.
Here's what I came up with:
- Silverstone LC18. Best HTPC Case. Ever. Touch screen a plus, but expensive.
http://www.silverstonetek.com/products/p_contents.php?pno=lc18
- LG GGC-H20L BLU-RAY/HD-DVD. No format war.
- Hauppage HVR 1800 Tuner Card (dual-NTSC,ATSC/QAM) Most compatible.
(if you already have digital cable this will decode the HD rebroadcasts
without any cable box, just plug it into an active cable outlet)
http://www.hauppauge.com/pages/products/data_hvr1800.html
- Radeon HD 2600 video (512MB better) Designed for Blu-Ray/HD-DVD playback. HDCP. Cheap.
- Athlon X2 Dual Core 6400+ (faster for cheaper)
- Gigabyte GA-M57SLI-S4 (2.0+!!!! All u need.)
- Vista Home Premium (I like it better than the XP Media Center for a HTPC, just need to update drivers and have at least 2GB mem).
If i get a Blu-Ray player installed as an option in a HTPC (laptop), will it upconvert standard DVD's to 1080p, or even 1080i?
I'm thinking of having this video card option installed in the HP HDX when it becomes available:
Nvidia GeForce 8800M GTS 512MB GPU
I am good at this. I prepared a smokin' prototype I coined the "Blu-berry": a roughly Tivo-sized Blu-ray player (+Sony BD burner) with aluminum case, internal PCI HDTV tuner/WIFI adapters, PowerDVD software + Vista Premium for media center features. I enjoyed running iTunes and Firefox (plus Eclipse for sofware development) on it too. Great machine. The video card is an Nvidia 8800GTS, and the CPU is an Intel Core 2 Duo. This machine looks and sounds great for games and Blu-ray discs and time-shifting HDTV onto your high definition display. It performs more capably than any others I've seen or heard of to date.
I hook this up to a Denon receiver for audio (7.1 speakers). I considered it a cost effective way to go. (I also think the PS3 is a good option, albeit with different functions and more limitations.)
Being a Java developer by day with entrepreneurial leanings, I wanted to commercialize this HTPC as the "Blu-berry" and (in Apple's tradition) build some additional usability and appeal into the thing.
Long story short: my long-standing (2005) USPTO trademark application ("Blu-berry") caught the attention of a certain maker of darker-berried handheld devices. They threatened me with expensive legal proceedings, not wanting my Blu-berry trademark to see the light of day.
I'd be interested to hear if this community thinks there is a market for such a device; I might renew my efforts.
(As it stands, I was considering abandoning the HTPC + Vista commercial wunderbox idea all together and just turning my pretty HTPC into an Linux "fair use"/ backup machine. See: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RestrictedFormats/BluRayAndHDDVD
I'd be less inclined to market that one, but it could still provide inspiration to others as at least a blueprint.)
I'm very happy with my HTPC setup.
Asus P5E-VM HDMI mATX mobo
Nmedia 288BA HTPC case
Coolmax AP-500X powersupply
Gyration Media Center PC Air Remote and Keyboard
LG GGC-H20L Blu-Ray HD-DVD combo drive
Intel Core 2 Duo E6750 2.66Ghz
OCZ 2x1GB Platinum PC2-6400 800MHz 240-pin DDR2
Windows Vista Home Premium with Media Center
PowerDVD
The Asus motherboard's built in HDCP compliant HDMI port passes audio fine. It goes through my Samsung FP-5084 TV out the back via optical cable to my receiver where it plays fine.
The key is having a good Media remote. The Gyration is pretty good. It acts as a mouse, almost like a nintendo Wiimote, I just wave it around the air, so I don't need a smooth surface. It controls the TV, and also my DirecTv DVR.
PowerDVD more or less works with Media Center. When I clock on "play dvd" in media center, it runs powerdvd. So it doesn't run natively in media center. Of course it requires some minor hacking to get it to work like that, details on google. That's the trade off.
Intel Core 2 Duo E6750 Conroe 2.66GHz LGA 775 65W Dual-Core Processor
ASUS P5E LGA 775 Intel X38 ATX Intel Motherboard
Patriot Extreme Performance 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400)
EVGA 320-P2-N815-AR GeForce 8800GTS Superclocked 320MB 320-bit GDDR3 PCI Express x16 HDCP
Creative SOUND BLASTER X-Fi Platinum 7.1 Channels PCI Interface Sound Card
Creative GigaWorks S750 THX 7.1 Speakers
Western Digital Raptor WD360GD 36.7GB 10,000 RPM Serial ATA150 Hard Drive
Western Digital Raptor X WD1500AHFD 150GB 10,000 RPM Serial ATA150 Hard Drive
Western Digital Caviar SE16 WD5000KS 500GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive
Western Digital Caviar SE16 WD7500AAKS 750GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive
SAMSUNG 20X DVD±R DVD Burner Black SATA Model SH-S203B
LG Blu-ray/HD DVD-ROM & 16X DVD±R DVD Burner Black SATA Model GGC-H20L
PC Power & Cooling Turbo-Cool 510 SLI
Antec Nine Hundred Black Steel ATX Mid Tower Computer Case
XP PRO SP2. Nvidia driver 169.21, setup monitors as dualview
Dell UltraSharp 2407WFP-HC 24-inch Widescreen Flat Panel LCD Monitor
Panasonic TH-42PZ700U 42" 1080p Plasma HDTV via DVI->HDMI cable
PowerDVD Deluxe
Works great for me with HD DVD & Bluray
has anyone had the opportuntiy to try out the new Ricavision Vave 100. It's a Universal remote, MCE remote and the kicker is that it has a SideShow display also. http://www.ricavision.com/vave100.html
Thanks for the comments guys, been a great help!