Nielsen VideoScan High-Def market share for week ending May 4th, 2008
By Ben Drawbaugh 
posted May 9th 2008 10:00PM
posted May 9th 2008 10:00PM
We said that Home Media Magazine gave up on HD DVD last week, but really there was still one chart left on the Nielsen VideoScan chart. This week even that one is gone and replaced with another consumer index on consumer spending, but this time for DVD. This makes it evident that while Blu-ray sales were down by 23% last week, DVD was only down by 5%. This helps explain why Blu-ray only managed a 5% share as compared to 6% week before. Again, this week 8 out of the top 20 DVD titles are not also available on Blu-ray, including two from long time Blu studios; Fox and Disney. The other big difference that is every evident this week is the movie demographic of each. While DVD fans ran to 27 Dresses and pushed it to number one, the opposite is true on Blu where The Golden Compass outsold the chick flick by almost 3:1. I Am Legend continues to have long legs and still separates itself from the rest of the list even after seven weeks. Looking forward to next week, it doesn't look like Blu will do very well with the biggest titles not being very appealing to Blu's apparent demographic, but things should change once all the studios are on board in the next month or so.
Oh, that trend better not continue.
Hopefully things rebound when Paramount and Universal start releasing titles.
The down turn is not surprising when you look at the U.S economy at the moment.
Yeah Bluray is taking a backseat to my car to be honest right now.
I certainly hope the whiners (all two of them) are satisfied with the statistics now.
You've got everything there now: total dollars spent on DVD sales and total dollars spent on Blu-Ray.
There's also still the "top 20" comparison which everybody understood and most of us (two whiners excepted) thought was fair. You know, since it's not reasonable to compare "total sales" when the entrained format has so many more movies available, and BD has less than 600. And, you know, because comparing number of disks sold between a format that offers $3 bargains at WalMart and one selling movies in the $12-$25 doesn't quite make sense.
Looky there, though, whiners! The money spent on BD's is actually about 7% of the money spent on DVD's....not the 0.5% you thought it would be. See how that top-20 comparison wasn't so horribly flawed? Do you get it now? Do you see?
Or maybe you still want absolute numbers...because you need something to complain about. Maybe you can say that you *know* in your little heart that BD's are way expensive...especially if you're comparing new $35 MSRP BD titles (which any normal person can find for $20) to $5 DVD's out of Wal-Mart's bargain bin. So OMG WTF BBQ, those $7 million in BD sales is only like 25 disks...and the $100 million spent on DVD's has got to be at least 100 million disks!!!! LOOK LOOK Blu-Ray is failing!
Or, you know, you could admit you can't do math, admit you know nothing about statistics/ratings, and admit that most of all, you don't know more than f'ing Nielsen on these subjects.
perfectly said... lets see what they complain about. probably the amount of unnesesary energy spent on the factories to create blu ray discs and its contribution to global warming or something like that...
^ ^ Simple really, BR is too expensive and only caters for the elitist niche.
Gus gets a fail.
Previous weeks, all you did was complain about the statistics, because they only compared top-20 sales numbers. Now you've got your total sales figures...and they aren't the 0.6% you were telling everybody they would be. BR sales revenue is 7% of DVD sales. And sad little you, all you can do is blurt out that BR is too expensive?
Nobody here is saying "BR already beat DVD!"...but there is no evidence in the statistics that BR is failing either. No evidence that only "rich" people are buying it either.
10 years ago, DVD players were hundreds of dollars too. Did you tell everybody that DVD's would always be for rich people only? BR disks, despite the high MSRP, don't actually sell at a much higher price than DVD's do, either.
For example: check out the movie 300 on Amazon:
BR: $19.95
HD DVD combo: $20.95
DVD Widescreen: $12.99
DVD Fullscreen: $18.49
DVD 2-disk: $24.99.
The BR price looks pretty middle-of-the-pack to me...
Those week-to-week stats are the stupidest thing ever. Weekly sales are so heavily influenced by titles released, so they're bound to be all over the place. They don't really indicate any meaningful trend.
Wow, I'm impressed that the TOTAL dollars spent ratio is actually higher than just comparing the Top 20. It does make sense to me since 8/20 top titles are not available on Blu-ray.
So the total dollar spend is roughly 7% while the top 20 spend is only 5%.
BTW, Why are half of the top 20 films not available on Bluray after so much time now???? When are the studios going to release DVD along with Blu-ray at the same time for every new title?? What gives?
Blu-ray needs some good movies to preview on this format.
Not JUST good movies because all that does is perpetuate the "Yeah blu-ray looks a lot better than DVD, but that's it so I'll just stick with up converting."
Like it or not, it's going to take a lot more than just better sound and picture to get J6P's attention.
So, how many weeks of this is required before the Blu-Ray Disc Association re-instates BOGOs if for no other reason than to prop up the numbers?
All the idiots who keep comparing blu ray to DVD keep forgetting DVD v VHS was a MAJOR change in format.
Blu ray is just a small evolutionary step in the progress of DVD, so to compare prices of blu ray players and discs to DVD 10 years ago is a self deluding joke!
DVD was a complete new format that offered massive improvements in functionality, storage, audio, video etc. BR is the same product offering improved audio and video, so will all you people stop making the ludicrous comparisons , it simply is not true and does not wash, as is evident with the very slow and poor sales of HD material.
For the average consumer, all BR offers is an improved picture, BIG DEAL!
Your name is HD4ME so basically you're an idiot based on your own comment: Blu = just an improved picture ...ya, as in HD?
You get what you pay for, you want a car, spend 10k, you want a decent care, spend 25k, you want a BMW, you spend more, and Ferrari, even more. That's life and the best things in life are for those who appreciate them and can afford them.
Complain all you want about Blu prices and people who compare VHS to DVD vs Blu to DVD, The point is new technology is costly at first and then it goes down in price. Just because there is less added functionality doesn't mean it should be cheap fast.
@Xdragqueen.
Why is it u blu zealots are so fast and ferocious to defend BR?
Its just a F'N DVD player that is exorbitantly over priced, for the most part under specified, and early tech has nothing to do with the BR cartel deliberately setting up a pricing structure to gouge the unwary consumer.This tech all ready could be , and should be, much cheaper but idiots like you are happy supporting your japanese overlords in their endeavors to create a monopoly specifically designed to fleece not only the early adopters but anyone who comes afterwards.
You can keep your lame, under performing, anti consumer product and stick it right where the sun doesn't shine!
Why is it you always chime in with the exact same thing stated in the exact same way?...do you just have this all prewritten and then copy and paste for every news post related to blu-ray?
Ummmm.......maybe because it's the the truth, sorry pal, sometimes that hurts!
HD4ME, just admit it. You are just posting these crybaby comments because your own format died.
@Dr Xym
well, "your" format is doing too well tbh. I do have to say, the curves for BD are going in completely wrong direction, i mean, this is what the consumers wanted, right? Why isn't it going the other direction?
I'm seriously planning getting a BD player, probably around christmas or so, but the more it's pointing downards, the more sceptical i become over the format. Sure you can blame it on the economy, blame it on that all movies are not being released on BD, blame it on whatever, but the fact is that the proces are too high! If the price is right it doesn't matter if the economy is not doing so well, or that all movies are not on BD if they cost less. Money talks, bullshit walks!!
Lower the goddamn prices and people will come. And it's true what HD4me is saying, the difference between a DVD and BD is just not too significant to impress the mass market, i do also think this will quickly become a niche product, unfortunately....
The point i was making is that you contradict yourself with your name vs your comments.
You and your few regular Blu haters say the same thing every week. I'm not really pushing Blu, I'm just pointing out errors in your view.
Many people don't know enough about Blu or HD in general and if they were to come here and read the complete bullshit from the same crew, its promotes ignorance.
Look carefully, I got voted down to low on a comment just because I was saying Blu releases have been crap which to me, i find stupid because they can release so many big movies that people will actually want. I clearly give praise and flack were its due. So me saying don't expect a shit movie to sell well just because its in 1080p make the Blu freaks vote me down. Now stop labeling me either way because I'm clearly not a hater, I do own and buy Blu because its the only HD disc available; keep in mind I would be buying HD-DVD if it had won as I want my movies in HD on a disc, and finally, me pointing out Blu's issues shows that I'm not a Blu zealot.
Don't misunderstand my comments, I do get frustrated when people try to say things that aren't true, but that goes for anything and that's when I post against comments.
Good news for Blu and certainly good enough to shut up the usual nay sayers with there repetative crap. Lets see what new spin they use since yet again they are WRONG!
Blu needs better movies to come out and i'm surprised at the movie choices being released. There's loads of good movies to be released, yet crap that didn't do well in the movies or on dvd seem to get Blu versions?
Where's Gladiator, Transformers, LOTR? You can't sell crap just because it looks better, give us some good back catalog movies!
Warner and Disney have the right idea; release it on Blu a week earlier than dvd to help give Blu more visibility and include extras that are only available on Blu.
Honestly, I wouldn't expect LOTR until the 2008 Holiday season at the earliest. It seemed pretty obvious they were waiting for one format to emerge the victor in the format war before they even started working on the HD versions. Now that's it's over and they only have to worry about making a Blu-Ray version, I imagine they're taking their time making something special if the collectors editions of the DVDs are any indication. They know it will sell like crazy when it is released regadless of when.
I'm not a betting person, but I would put my money on there being a huge (and expensive) collectors set out just in time for the holidays this year that will sell like crazy regardless of the price.
Good news for Blu and certainly good enough to shut up the usual nay sayers with there repetative crap. Lets see what new spin they use since yet again they are WRONG!
Blu needs better movies to come out and i'm surprised at the movie choices being released. There's loads of good movies to be released, yet crap that didn't do well in the movies or on dvd seem to get Blu versions?
Where's Gladiator, Transformers, LOTR? You can't sell crap just because it looks better, give us some good back catalog movies!
Warner and Disney have the right idea; release it on Blu a week earlier than dvd to help give Blu more visibility and include extras that are only available on Blu.
End of May & June has got the National Treasure 1 & 2, Narnia, Dirty Harry series, Rambo series, Patton, Longest Day, Cloverfield, Spiderwick Chronicles, and a pile more.
This month and last were just had shit releases and the sales reflect that. As might be expected, it looks like things really start ramping up in the second half of the year.
This just goes to show how many PS3 players are being used as blu-ray players.
The end of May and June is where I expect to see a significant improvement. There are some great releases appearing starting in 3 weeks. The releases this month haven't been that great.
Of course Blu-ray movie revenue is disproportionately higher, the movies are themselves priced disproportionately higher
(no matter how much one cherry picks 1 or even a handful of titles to 'prove' how middle of the pack they are.....you must be joking ).
Presumably this stat also only refers to the USA.
I know some American folks have the most incredible parochial tunnel vision when it comes to the rest of the world & themselves but times have changed, Europe is a larger single market than the US so this hardly indicates anything about the wider global situation
(which given that high def TV was selling in the USA years before Europe got it is in itself an untypical situation).
It's a tiny minority disc format in a small minority TV market in a minority consumer market.
Even in the USA Blu-ray remains a $400, $500, $600 & even $700+ niche, nothing they have done lately indicates they are going after the mass-market.
Sad but true, Blu-ray is the niche product at prices that merely ensure it fails to take off before something else comes along that will engage the mass-market.
Ultimately it'll be just as dead as HD DVD and yous didn't even get to benefit from the inexpensive prices.
I'm buying my HD DVD movies @ £5/$10 btw.
Nice.
What they fail to remember also, increased revenue does not necessarily mean increased profits, the cost structure for this product is so high, and the turn over so low team blu must be ripping $millons......oh dear, how sad, never mind.
Exactly HD4ME..
Kids and fanboys can't understand that studios are not releasing movies because it's TOO FREAKING EXPENSIVE. As you said, the jump from DVD to BR is simply not that stunning as it was from VHS to DVD.
This was the fundimental difference between BR and HD DVD that everyone was talking about. This is why HD DVD had a chance at mass market and BR simply doesn't.
Don't forget that studios are now making a BUCKET LOAD of money through Apple TV / iTunes and Xbox Live renting and selling movies digitally as well. No packaging, no replication, just cash for them.
And this of course doesn't really make them invest huge amounts of money into Blu-Ray replication when they know that the only base for consumers they have is the PS3.
Even the new movies coming out this summer. It's already too late. They won't shift numbers at all imo. Cloverfield and other hits are already out on DVD, so they will sell poorly on BR. The only 2 movies that will definitely make some numbers in HD are Iron Man and Batman (and MAYBE, just maybe Hulk) but that's it. The consumer sure ain't gonna buy a $700 standalone player to get 30% increase in picture quality over the DVD. Let's be real here.
Blu-ray replication costs were little more than HD DVD.
TT: Nobody cherry-picked a title. I went with 300 because it was one of the major releases. I looked up exactly one movie, and came back with its prices. But, to keep you happy, I went back to Amazon to look up some other prices.
Literally, all I did this time is go to the Blu-Ray section at amazon and take the first few titles. Here's what I found:
National Treasure / National Treasure 2 - Book of Secrets: $40 (that's $20 per movie, just like 300). The DVD versions (there are several for each movie) range in price from $14.99-$19.99.
Blade Runner (5-disk collectors edition): $27.95 (umm...that's less than $6 per disk) (DVD prices are: 2-disk for $15.99 ($8 per disk), 4-disk for $22.99 (just under $6 per disk), and 5-disk ultimate for $58.99...but that includes some extra goodies.)
I am Legend: $18.95 (that movie has been selling well for months...DVD prices are $15.99 for widescreen, $22.99 for 2-disk special, and $19.99 for full screen.)
Golden Compass: $27.95 (that seems expensive to me, and indeed the DVD's are around $17)
So, out of the 4 movies that I didn't "pick and choose," 3 are basically in line with DVD prices, one is significantly more expensive. Big woop. Of course, I expect you'll have some *real good reasoning* as to why these titles would be cheaper than others on BD...so go for it, champ!
I don't give a damn about the formats...I still use DVD anyway. I just can't read some of these nonsense comments without responding...
Hey Nfinity, maybe Sony should pay for the enhancements to HD like Toshiba was doing with Star Trek?
HD4ME and NFinity:
Please try to come up with one coherent argument, rather than a series of conflicting ones.
First it was: Blu-Ray is a colluding, anti-consumer group that's price-gouging its own customers.
Now it's: They're selling BD's so close to the manufacturing cost that they can't make any profit!
And you're even saying: Digital downloads are way cheap to make, but they still sell them to consumers at a huge price! Yay!
Which is it? Are is Blu-ray an anti-consumer monopoly, or are they making prices as cheap as possible?
Are digital downloads, which cost full price for a DRM-locked electronic copy that can't be transported, really the consumer-friendly dream you hope for? Now you want companies to make huge profits at your expense?
Before HD DVD crumbled, HD DVD's sold at basically the same prices as BR's...so were the HD DVD disk manufacturers price gouging if their disks were so cheap to make but cost as much as the expensive BD's?
And, I'm not sure if you remember or not, but Toshiba spent months selling their HD DVD players below the manufacturing cost. They were making negative profit. Players so cheap that nobody else thought it was worth while to get into the HD DVD player manufacturing business. Of course, certain commenters *loved* THEM for it at the time, didn't they?
Geez Truth theres a first, you got a highest ranked!!! :)
Ummm....Gus....you just got "highly ranked" for saying how high TT's rating was? Seriously? Are we expected to believe that so many people thought that comment was uniquely insightful and useful to the discussion?
Maybe you're not doing it...but clearly somebody's voting you up for no real reason...
How many votes does it take to get that high? I'm guessing that somebody...one of the folks voting repeatedly for the anti-blu crowd...has a pretty clear idea about the answer to that question.
Cute, real cute.
EQC, I normally remain tolerant and friendly, but your pathetic immature jibes are starting to piss me off!!
I don't know what you think is going on idiot, but the fact that people might be voting others comments up that you don't agree is a very distinct and real possibility, not everyone is a brainwashed tool like you!
The comment directed at TT was somewhat humorous as anyone coming to this site regularly would know, TT usually gets smashed with lowest ranked comments, so my comment no doubt would have made a few people smile, resulting in a higher voting.
Don't be such an arrogant wan*er to think that just because a comment doesn't interest you, therefore it wont be of interest to others!
You and MR.E need to grow up and stop carrying on like a couple of giddy young teenagers getting a fat over you blu ray machines your moms bought you for your birthdays!
Take it easy Gus...if you re-read my comments, you'd see I'm not even pro-blue. I don't own an HD player of any kind.
I am not pro-blue or anti-HD DVD. I am anti-nonsense, and anti-misinterpretation of facts.
You first caught my attention with your insistence that the "top 20" ratings were meaningless. I tried to explain to you a week or so ago the value in those numbers, but you ignored me. Oh, you responded to my post...but you didn't read past my first line. You can see the discussion here:
http://www.engadgethd.com/2008/05/02/nielsen-videoscan-high-def-market-share-for-week-ending-april-27/
Look close, you'll see that you first came out arguing with your misinterpretation of reality:
"...Just PRINT THE FACTS, BR is at about 0.6% market share overall, not this fairy flossed result, why do you have to print this crap, 0.6%, the truth doesn't hurt, just print it!"
See, you simultaneously insisted that BR's market share was 10x lower than the top-20 numbers, and also insisted that everybody reading the statistics thought they were total sales numbers (as if we were all too stupid to read the print that clearly stated "top 20". You also, apparently, thought that Engadget was making the statistics, not Nielsen.
My response:
"Gus: what do you mean when you say "this site"???
Engadget isn't putting those plots together. It is Nielsen. You know, the most trusted statistics/ratings company in the world.
Any moron can look at the graph and see the footnote under it to realize that we're comparing BR's top 20 to DVD's top 20...."
See that "any moron" part? Everybody knows what statistics we were looking at...while you insisted we had no idea and couldn't read. And after that, I went on to explain some logical reasons why a top-20 statistic is useful at this point. I opened it up for reasonable discussion...made my rational argument, in the hopes that you'd either understand, or counter my rational argument with one of your own.
But what happened? Well, you responded:
"EQC, this site IS FALSLY representing the numbers. If you get your magnifying glass out and read the fine print, these figures are based the top 20 movies only, hence we get a much higher and FALSE report."
So, you basically ignored everything I said, and called me wrong, and again insisted that I didn't know these were top-20 stats and that Engadget was collecting and interpretting the data.
See the nonsense you've delivered yet?
EQC, that long winded, condescending, self righteous response only shows me what a true fu*kwit you really are!
ouch, that stings. Once again, an anti-blu guy ignores the issues and resorts to personal attacks.
Once again, the anti-blu group got angry and made some ridiculous argument, somebody else (me in this case) responded with an attempt at logic and reason, and the anti-blu group responded by ignoring the response entirely and resorting to personal attacks.
Thanks. Thanks so much.
Amen HD4ME, EQC has proven he is a full blown knob jockey with his constant drivel!
Just ignore his immature rants and treat him the the contempt he deserves!
* quote
Spiza
This just goes to show how many PS3 players are being used as blu-ray players.
=====================================================
.....well let's be honest, when a game console has hardly any worthwhile games then they're a bit of a dead loss as a games console, aren't they?
:P
You and NFinity should get together and try to work out a unified argument.
You say: BluRay is a console format, only for the PS3.
NFinity says: BluRay is going to get killed by people downloading movies onto their 360.
You realize that the 360 is just another console, right?
Geeze...I'm still using DVD myself. I don't give a damn about the formats...but I can't just sit around and *not* respond to the nonsense and conflicting arguments some of you guys spout off.
I'd disagree, but I haven't bought any games. I more of PC gamer though so orange box, bioshock, and COD4 have all been purchased for PC. I have more of a problem paying $60 for games. Free demos are nice though.
Wow, have you ever heard of various views that can be differing yet not mutually exclusive?
Actually I said Blu-ray is almost exclusively about PS3.
Nfinity points to XBox360 downloads as a growing sector of the market which may grow much larger than the PS3/Blu-ray business.
....and what?
They are not mutually exclusive statements.
Nfinity can answer for himself but as far as I'm concerned I think you might like to reconsider.
It's true that the XBox d/ls are growing & going to be big a big section of the high def market.
It's also true that for as long as Blu-ray revolves almost totally around PS3 it isn't going anywhere in the a/v mass-market.
If I'd tried to say that the XBox d/l's were a sign of entry and a great deal of penetration into the mass-market then you might have a point but I didn't.
Yes, the XBox 360 is also an element of the game console niche, when did I ever say otherwise, hmmmm?
Some of you guys ought to get it into your heads that some of the rest of us could really care less for the notion of any game console 'wars'.
It's sometimes funny poking fun at the game-less PS3 game console but I really couldn't give a f*ck about the XBox 360 either.
The XBox 360 HD DVD add-on was nice cos it gave us a high def ROM drive for the PC cheaply but that's about as far as it goes for me.
thats it. seeing as how every week they release the same charts over and over, and how the same people come every week and say the same things over and over, im trouh with this site. dont need to read (^^^) all those bullshit comments over and over again. (^^^) i cant belive how they think thats informative or anything.
I just rent my Blu-ray movies. It's nice knowing that both my local places have a good stock of them now that HDDVD is gone and dead. Thanks god the format war is over and we NEVER need to hear about HDDVD again!
These number are really encouraging to see.
The market numbers are much better than I feared. It's great to see that even on a down week BD can make number that big when compared to the totality of the DVD market.
It looks like there will be along future ahead for BD.
oops... i hope those three ^^^ dont read that!!!
First of all Jove, I thought you said you weren't coming back, WTF?? ... you lied! ....and second, apologies for having an opinion that differs from yours, perhaps all those with differing opinions, repetitive or not, should move on eh?
2007 compact disc music sales: 7.5 Billion
2007 digital music sales: 1.25 Billion
As a Blu-ray owner I will likely not be buying any new Blu-Ray discs but will continue to buy regular DVDs.
We purchased (my wife and I are chronic movie re-watchers) a few Blu-Rays over the past few weeks and although we are happy with them we are unhappy with the fact that we cannot bring the movies over to friends houses to watch (we actually do stuff like that...I KNOW!) because the friends don't have Blu-Ray.
I am very happy with the upscaling video quality and will likely stick to regular DVDs until Blu-Ray players get a bit more commonplace.