Is the future of Windows Media Center with Windows Home Server?
By Ben Drawbaugh 
posted May 22nd 2009 2:00PM
posted May 22nd 2009 2:00PM
At first it might seem like a stretch to connect the future of Windows Media Center (WMC) with Windows Home Server (WHS), but hear us out. To understand this line of thought, first you have to look to the past failures of WMC and the trends in the PC marketplace. The original HTPC idea was that people wanted to connect a PC to their HDTV to access more content, but in reality only uber geeks are actually able to achieve the desired results. So Microsoft shifted gears and developed the Extender model which put a CE device at each TV with the real brains of the operation on a PC hidden away back in an office -- where PCs belong. This seemed like a great idea, that was until people stopped buying regular PCs and started buying laptops. The fact is that most people these days don't even own a regular desktop, instead opting for a more versatile portable. So what good is a version of Windows that can record TV, if you take the computer with you when your shows are on? Again, real enthusiasts don't care, they'll just buy both. But for the rest, this is where Windows Home Server comes in.
Windows Home Server has become one of the best laptop companion accessories available today. It makes it drop dead simple to backup all your computers -- both individual files and the entire system -- gives you an easy-to-use centralized repository for all your media and even remote access capabilities. The amazing thing is that the product is able to do all of this for a relatively low cost of about $500. We believe that the next version of WHS will also let you add tuner support and will not only let you record your shows and watch live TV on an Extender, but it will also let you watch TV on your Windows 7 laptop.
If you're already a WHS fan, at this point you are asking, "then why hasn't Microsoft done this already?" That answer is actually pretty obvious if you know that current version of WHS is built on Windows 2003 Server. It was released in the Fall of 2007, about five months before Windows Server 2008 and about a year after Windows Vista. Obviously there wasn't any point in including the older Media Center code in WHS, and with Server 2008 still off in the future, it couldn't use Vista's Media Center code either (Vista and Server 2008 share the same code base).
Since the release of WHS there have been a few updates that shows that Microsoft is already working in this direction. Most notably was Power Pack 2 which included a Media Center connector (pictured above) that made it really easy to access all the media on the WHS from within WMC -- this was possible before, but required some manual configuration including a few registry entries. The other trend out of Redmond that points us in this direction is the new BDA driver architecture. This allows hardware manufactures to develop their own hardware with less interaction from Microsoft and is kind of a standard like NDIS is for network adapters. Yet another indicator is the support of UPnP based tuners, as well as the "Shared TV" features of Windows 7. All of this combined with a little less DRM on CableCARD recordings and native satellite support starts to make this picture very clear to us.
Here's how it might work. You'll go into a big box store and buy a Windows Home Server with a few terabytes of storage for around $500 and bring it home. It won't include any tuners, but will have plenty of USB ports. Anyone who wants to watch TV on their PC will grab a USB tuner of their choice, which will (hopefully) include; ATSC, NTSC, CableCARD, DISH Network and DirecTV. Anyone who already has an Xbox 360 will be prompted during the WHS setup that they can connect the two devices together to watch TV. The 360 will work as an Extender for Media Center, much like it will on Windows 7 today -- this requires almost none of the complicated setup of a traditional HTPC. Using Live Mesh you'll be able to schedule recordings from anywhere and play them back on any Windows 7 computer on the network -- or even over the internet if you have your LiveID linked up. Who knows, you might even be able to watch the recordings on the rumored Zune HD by syncing it or streaming via Wifi. Now you should be wondering about Live TV on your laptop, because why not? No way to know for sure, but we believe the WHS will create a tuner pool of all the tuners you installed and expose these tuners to the network via UPnP. Then when you setup WMC on your laptop, it'll detect those tuners on the network and make them available for live TV or even local recordings. The WHS will manage the tuners to ensure there is a tuner available to record your favorite shows.
This product fits the laptop lifestyle and will be especially useful if you already own an Xbox 360, but the benefits don't stop there. Because WHS could only support tuners that use BDA drivers and the plug-in architecture of WHS is more limited than a PC the machine should be very stable. It should also use relatively low power compared to a regular PC. This combination could provide a very versatile and dependable DVR platform.
If any of this does come true, it'll be awhile. With Windows 7 due this fall, the earliest we'd expect any announcements from Microsoft about WHSv2 would be at CES, and then who knows how long before it's actually released. The other key question is cost. No matter how much the actual WHS sells for, if the tuners are too much it's all for naught. Currently CableCARD tuners for the PC retail at $300, which is way, way too much. If this price gets closer to $100, then we could see where this model could really compete head to head with the likes of TiVo in the DVR space. Sure there is still more up front cost, but the lack of service fees combined with the additional utility (backups, etc) and versatility, could make this a popular product.
I'm not really feeling any bad news with this, Linksys have decided to stop producing MCE extenders, so what ? I've found them to be slow and buggy (apart from the XBox 360 but it is way too loud)
I don't know about the states but in the UK most exenders I have seen are the kind of price I could build a more feature rich little cheap PC for.
The thing I think we all want is the ability to specify a central MCE system (master) and run other networked PCs from it like extenders (slaves) then you can share TV card access etc.
WHS has never really appealed to me, but then I already have an easy back-up plan and would rather all my systems had full Windows capabilities.
The one thing that makes MCE great for me are plug-ins, Like Media Browser, TunerFree MCE, ShoutCast Radio, If Microsft would work their usual magic and encourage a bigger ecosystem for partners to write more 3rd party plug-ins we would lall be happy people.
I believe we can already do this dream setup. With a windows 7 htpc and some tuners. By grabbing the concurrent rdp sessions hack (http://www.missingremote.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=3293&Itemid=232) and put windows 7 eee boxes on all the tvs you want this feature. Then Just rdp into the htpc and use its wmc. This would work right?
I have been waiting for this ability in WHS since I first grabbed on 2 years ago. However - I want one additional featue that I doubt I'll get. I also want the whs to be an interface itself, acting as a HTPC. I currently am using it that way in a custom HTPC box, and it sort of works, but much media software isn't designed for WHS(W2003S) so it's flakey, and the WHS desktop is certainly not for this purpose.
I just don't see the point of having the WHS sitting next to all the other equipment, and still needing an extender to watch it on the tv it's sitting next to.
Ben,
Knowing that Charlie Owen has left the media center team and being that Charlie was the biggest advocate of this kind of integration, do you think that this technology will ever make it to market?
Dallas Knox
Charlie was just one member of a large team. Based on feedback I've received off-the-record I'd say I'm VERY close to predicting this accurately.
Excellent summary and exactly what I want. I use Win7 RC + WHS and am increasily fed up that both are powered up 24*7.
I'd also add to your summary the recent announcement from Toshiba that they will be including Media Center Extender technology in 2H 2009 TVs.
Also, I wonder if someone like Samsung might add extender technology to a blu-ray player (as an alternative boot option).
Are you sure there isn't a little bit of MythTV envy here? ;)
Analog setup is not too bad, except I don't want to see every channel I never had. Mot a make or break issue for me, but a bit of an annoyance.
Digital.
After taking a couple of hours with the utility that came with my digital tuner making sure the channel listing is correct, compared to the Zap2it listing and ID, it wasn't because Comcast just re-arranged the channels after deciding to make everything 30 and above digital. Pretty much any TV software I've tried requires some time to do this type of setup, so that I accept.
Then it is annoyingly long to got through the setup in Media Center, wouldn't be so bad if it were only a first run kind of thing, but it's a pain every time you have to do a channel scan after theres been a line up change.
Windows 7 shows channels being detected, but then 0 channels mapped to guide data and if they are not mapped to guide data they don't exist as far as Media Center is concerned.
Maybe UPnP will ease things a bit, but I'm holding my breath.
Have not tried it in Windows 7 but Media Portal works pretty good for me. Not perfect by any stretch of the imagination, but improving little by little. Don't know how it meshes with WHS either, but I don't see any reason it shouldn't work.
Later, Seeker
the technology is here then the ingenious idea, all we need is convergence...
this is definitely do'able, if not already been done...
but it just needs to be packaged nicely for everyone...
Microsoft can take the complexity and pain out this with no effort at all...
But unless they wont earn much $$, they wouldn't care at all...
The future will be on the Apple side.
As usual.
You guys are dreaming. The key problem with Media Center is that, while, Microsoft delivered to the masses, no one used it other than us enthusisasts. The last thing they are going to do is create an architecture that the average user couldn't even begin to design for their home. Imagine the support problems with this type of design.
The biggest mistake that Microsoft made was not educating the masses on MC. No, I don't mean ad campaigns which they tried and the push with Dell and other oem's pushing "Media Center" OS's. I'm talking about teaching the average user on install, configure, and support MC in the home. Instead they suppor the Custom Integrator market, where, there is some money to be made, but no where near the money they could make pursuing the average user.
The extender was the first decent step toward the average user using MC, however, once again, there is no "education campaign" to go along with it. There was no ad campaigns showing the benefit to leverage what the average user most likely, already has.
I commend you dreamers at Endgadget who wrote this article, but until Microsoft has a change in their 'ehome' division, and I mean leadership change as well, then there will be no benefit for anyone.
Awesome article Ben - Great Job!
My issue is that the Einsteins in Redmond will not understand this simple architecture you put in few pages, let alone successfully implement it. I don’t care how close they are to doing this, according your sources. They have had years to do so and still haven't done it - I am not going to hold my breath.
They have messed up pretty much everything they have touched and why shall they not do it again? Just to name a few: Cable Card/DirecTV integration, Extenders, etc. The NIH syndrome runs rampant and causes all kinds of stupid actions to be taken – not much different than SONY, which recently admitted to such a mistake.
Anyway, I can’t wait to lay my hands on a such a dream system (if at all possible coming out of Redmond) at the price you describe above. Can sometime point me to where I can get the beta bits to see the latest works of a GM, I mean MSFT?
OK - I'm not coming from too much of a geek side, but it seems to me the integration could also be in the STB or receivers. HTPC people already can figure this all out with mad geek skills, but the average joe would just need to plug his wifi dongle or ethernet into the box. And it goes! I pretty much had that in the dark ages with ReplayTV, though I needed third party software. Clearly cable and satellite companies don't want me messing with their software, but they could really make themselves invaluable with a PnP setup to the WHS unit. I'm probably missing a bunch of stuff, but it seems to me the problems are companies trying to guarentee their income stream, not on the tech side.
I think what you've said would have been awesome 3-5 years ago but I do think we are moving slowly away from the model that content is delivered to your set at a given time on a given day of the week. Recording television and maintaining the storage for those recordings is a burden I would rather not bear. There are already multiple (too many) platforms for me to receive media that don't put the burden on me recording it (hulu, network websites, iTunes, Amazon, Netflix, etc). And when all else fails there's always bittorrent (which can have a very high WAF if implemented properly).
The eventual "winner" in the content distribution battle will be the one that notifies me when my desired programming is available, streams it to my TV in HD, and doesn't require me to buy a ridiculously expensive STB to do so.
The only fly in the ointment to this model are live events that a user would like to see in near realtime. The best example I can think of is sports. I have a high interest in sports while the game is being played but once the game ends and I know the score my interest drops to almost nothing. I think CBS has a clear winner with its MMOD system. If the NFL would adopt that model they could make a fortune charging folks to stream games. Sports is the only reason I haven't cut my cable. ESPN360 is a nice attempt but the quality was not very good last I checked.
The other smaller issues are the TV-as-background-noise and there's-nothing-on-so-let's-watch-crap. Some nights the TV is truly an idiot box. I think a lot of the marginal cable channels make a living showing programming a person would never set out to watch but might land on if nothing else is on. That type of market would be lost completely and I might never have seen that special on the world's longest bridge. I'm ok with that.
Thanks for the insight, Ben. That was better than CES.
I struggled through the limitations of Media Center and extenders for years, waiting in vain for the long promised DirecTV solution for it. When they finally shelved that (about 3 years after it was announced and constantly telling us "just wait, it's great...") I finally shelved my Media Center PC.
I think the near-ideal solution for those who want the key features of Media Center is Uverse (where available). It uses Microsoft's IPTV solution, and the interface is surprisingly (or unsurprisingly?) Media Center-like. You get the benefit of centralized storage of the recordings, which was the real seller to me for MC. You get one DVR box and several "extenders" that stream content from the DVR.
There are still some limitations in comparison to MC:
- No "trick play" on extenders with live TV (being worked on for phase 3 of Total Home DVR)
- Limited amount of space on hard drive of DVR ( I had 1TB on MC, now have 160GB)
- limited options for series record (missing things like "only keep xx episodes")
That said, the pace they are working on this thing and implementing features that were previously on MC is pretty good... I expect them to have live TV trick play on extenders by the end of the year, and I've been told I will at some point be able to use the USB port on the DVR to add more storage. The UI is running quite peppy right now.
Seems ideal as a replacement for those who are tired of waiting on MS... it seems they are much more interested in moving forward with this platform.