Toshiba applies for BDA admission, Blu-ray players and laptops coming soon
By Darren Murph 
posted Aug 10th 2009 3:20AM
posted Aug 10th 2009 3:20AM
"In light of recent growth in digital devices supporting the Blu-ray format, combined with market demand from consumers and retailers alike, Toshiba has decided to join the BDA. Toshiba aims to introduce digital products that support the Blu-ray format, including BD players and notebook PCs integrating BD drives, in the course of this year. Details of the products, including the timing of regional launches, are now under consideration. We will make announcements in due course."
If you can't beat 'em, join 'em. :)
amen to that. no point in crying over split milk time to make some money on the hot new thing.
the thing ain't so knew when it's coming into the 4th year ;)
"In light of recent growth in digital devices supporting the Blu-ray format, combined with market demand from consumers and retailers alike"
Growth? Market demand?
Well well well, guess we will be hearing from some people soon about how mislead the analysts at Toshiba must be since "we all know that BD is either dead or doomed to fail" :-)
All I asked for in the last 'Toshiba will.....' thread was something in the way of proof, not rumour.
This will do nicely.
As for Blu-ray's future?
Well, they obviously see a decent market in Japan.
Whether the rest of the world takes off as expected is quitre another matter and very reasonably open to question in view of the facts so far.
We'll see.
Its about time.
as for MFM, he's indeed followed suit with what he said in the past article about Toshiba. You could mention how maybe he saw the writing on the wall, but let's all let it go people.
Anyway, we've been waiting on your Toshiba. Now make one of these new 3rd gen media center extenders with Blu Ray playback built in (and I mean right into the MC interface, out outside) and I'll buy your brand day one.
As it was with Sony and VHS, not it is with Toshiba and Blu Ray. Each conceeded defeat, sucked it up and started making the competing format. The more the merrier I say.
"Sadly, Tosh doesn't bother to mention exactly what kinds of BD-capable wares it hopes to produce, nor is it ready to disclose product launch time frames. ."
Actually it does. From the press release:
"Toshiba aims to introduce digital products that support the Blu-ray format, including *BD players and notebook PCs integrating BD drives*, in the course of *this year*. "
So....they plan on releasing a budget player in September? Or are we looking at a $500 player to be released in December? Single disc? Multi-disc?
I'm with Engadget on this one; it's a pretty vague statement that doesn't give us any truly useful information other than "yeah, we'll put something out sometime before 2010".
It's about time. It is now morally safe of the last of the HD DVD holdouts to find some peace and come into the water...
I think you're being overly optimistic. The usual suspects will find some way to spin this away and pretend it doesn't mean anything.
I think that Toshiba is interested in adding BD drives to their good selling line of notebooks, rathen than players or recorders. I guess that's the major market their aiming to dive in. Because in the whole picture...BD isn't anywhere near DVD. And is not happening anytime soon. Maybe we people using HDTVs are well aware of BD benefits. But the majority of people is not. And I know some that even can't tell the difference between HD and SD! So, in the end...my e-pinion suggest that Toshiba wants to reinforce their offer in the notebook market
This should be confirmation that BD is at the very least, profitable for those making the players. Think about it, Toshiba had absolutely no need to go Blu if there was no money in it, especially after the losses it incurred during the format war.
Give us some quality BD players Tosh! The more competition, the better for us!
So when will Toshiba come out with Ultra High Def DVD?
Blu-ray is the last optical format. Tosh is set to release it's first SDXC in 64GB size early next year. The only way this won't be the case is if consumers will have the ability to burn holographic discs at home. Remember what happened to the last high capacity optical format that didn't have any home burning?
Paramount and Warner have already signed up with MOD Systems to do movie distribution of Standard Def content on SD cards. The size and speed of SDXC gives both the studios and MOD an card with the size and speed to load up a card with the same amount and quality as a BD with room and bandwith to spare. Not to mention studios can offer buy or rent on the same media.
Sure there's lots to do before SDXC can compete with Blu, (SDXC compatible readers in TV's, distribution system, retailer/kiosk establishment, etc.) but it's coming a lot sooner than any of us realize.
Given that they displayed a 2k upscaling HD TV recently that's an interesting question.
Producers are not going to turn from optical to some kind of flash solution. What is the reason for even doing this? It's easy and cheap to mass produce optical media. It isn't anywhere as easy or cheap to mass produce storage cards. I don't see that changing unless Toshiba or anyone else confounds people with 64Gb cards costing a buck.
I think optical's days are numbered but it will be replaced by a download solution. But even that is a lot further away than people think.
Is right about Blu-ray being the last optical media format WebDev511. As its been pointed out many times before, by many including myself, many of the companies involved in Optical Media believe this and are re-organizing to support multiple "future" digital media distribution methods, including Sony, Microsoft, DVD Forum, and Toshiba. The interesting thing about this development is Toshiba is still pushing the use of resilient flash memory to distribute films but at this point in time it seems unlikely that ModSystems' distribution method is good to go for the launch mid year of this year as stated at E3. Why?
Well Toshiba has been core in developing the hardware technology behind the distribution system and they know what is going on in the requirements for this field, but one has to consider what is coming down the line for both the home entertainment industry and computer industry, because they are now becoming intertwined. Many companies have been developing 2160p QHDTVs, but there is nothing to play on them at full capacity at this time, and with a $10000+ price tag these are expected to launch with will be a very hard sell. Even though the unsubstantiated claim about Blu-ray supporting the 2k/4k based resolution no proof of this can be produced because of known bandwidth capacities which projectors are required to support a maximum bandwidth of 250Mb/s in comparison to Blu-ray using 48Mb/s, for those of you with problems doing math that's less than 1/5th the max bit-rate of 2k/4k, so there is not any viable format available outside of PC's which a dedicated USB can do said bit-rate, but USB is not normally dedicated this is an unlikely solution at this time. Why is this important, because the USB 3.0 specs can support the required bandwidths to stream full 2160p video, with a maximum bit rate of 500 MB/s it can support much higher, BUT USB 3.0 isn't even live yet and won't be common place for another year or more, which is not a problem because with the expected price tag of the 2160p QHDTVs being as high as they are and expected to come down before they are mass market ready there is time to wait.
What it comes down to is 480p quality video distributed by the ModSystems method is really kind of pointless, with internet speeds the way they are and available players/systems for streaming video to the TV there is not a need for a Flash based format at this time, and I think Toshiba sees this, but in about 6 years when DVD Forum has placed DVD's max expiration date and Blu-ray will be hitting its senior years there will a need for the technology in a high resolution format, which Mod and Toshiba has made no announced plans on what they are doing about that other than its feasible some time down the line.
More proof of this being a case of future planing over implementation is the fact that everything is in place to support Flash 480p/1080p distribution. Right now we have the flash media for the 8GB required for full DVD fairly cheap and the storage capacity for Blu-ray/HD DVD (movies only) with the available bandwidth to stream them all, just no common "players." Once the new SDXC formats become available there will be more than enough space for full Blu-ray capacity.
What will be seen of this technology in the near future? I can't really say, I suspect it will be market tested and distribution bugs worked out in the kiosk systems, and with 6 years of expected optical media competition they have more than enough time to get their ducks in a row.
Another example of industry acceptance of the media Sony tested distribution of Ghostbusters, and an extremely over priced rate, over in Europe on flash drives (thumb sticks), and Disney is test distributing some films on SD cards at a premium rate.
The flash thing is such a lark. Its a novelty that will have about as much impact as Sony's UMD's. The content providers will dip their toes in the water and you may see a few random titles tested out on flash but nothing significant will ever become of it. Optical discs are too well established and downloads/streaming is gaining momentum. Nobody wants (or needs) yet another physical format. Its just not a good time to introduce another physical format.
Flash is a waste of time for several reasons which people conveniently ignore:
1. It is too expensive
2. It offers no significant benefits over optical discs for the kind of media it is playing
Issue 1 more or less kills the proposition entirely. People are lauding SDXC, a technology which doesn't even exist when even crappy old 1-2Gb cards aren't even cheap enough to compare with optical. Realistically it's going to take many years for a 64Gb card to be remotely attractive from a price point compared to optical.
In the face of issue 1 the ONLY way this tech could work right now is if people bought their own SDXC, took it to a kiosk in a store, downloaded a movie onto it, took it home and watched it from the flash or transferred it to HDD so they could reuse the SDXC. What if someone wanted to watch a boxed set or several titles at once? Are they going to have buy multiple cards, or make multiple trips? Are the stores going to have to implement a deposit system in case you turn up having forgotten or run out of flash cards?
It just isn't a workable solution and kills impulse purchasing stone dead. It also causes a huge headache where the issue of how to transfer content to flash is compounded by having to send the card back and forth.
Download is the future but even that is way off. It's easy to forget that most people even in America do not have the bandwidth to download huge movies and most of the rest of the world is in even worse shape. It's likely that physical is going to be dominant for a good while to come.
I think Toshiba needs to go through some sort of hazing ritual before they can join. Maybe write a 500 word essay entitled "Why Blu-Ray is way better than HD-DVD", or at least make the president of Toshiba walk around with a dunce cap on for a week.
Unfotunately for the consumer HD DVD was the better format for the mass-market.
It was the finished article (Blu-ray has litteraly taken years to offer the features HDi offered) and was so much more user friendly than the Java mess Blu-ray uses.
I know, I have both.
The biggest deal was the low production line cost.
I wonder if the current discounting on Blu-ray films will last (I'm reminded of the drying up of all the 3 for 2 and various deals when HD DVD departed).
They spent a small fortune establishing Blu-ray, I can't see them not wanting their money back from it.
Or you could wear the dunce cap for not realizing (after all these years) that it's not called 'HD-DVD'?
I think this says a lot about the future of Blu. Toshiba wouldn't be getting in the market unless it's starting to turn more profitable. The HD-Xa2 rivaled OPPO upscalers in the past and combining their latest upscaling tech witha BD player makes perfect sense for those not willing to shell out 500 for the OPPO 83.
P.S. - You sound as bad as ANY HD DVD fanboi with all the Toshiba hate. They tried to dominate the HD market as they had done for years with DVD. It made perfect sense at the time. Not jumping straight into Blu also made sense after just dumping millions into a flailing format. If anyone wants to argue that Blu was a strong product after Toshiba called it quits, be my guest, but the numbers don't support that. Looks like they finally do, and that's a good thing for everybody.
@MFM,
HD-DVD the better format? Well you know, there is obviously a few people around here that wouldn't agree with you there.
HDi or BD Live or whatever. I couldn't care less. I only care about the film itself and all this extra garbage is just uneccessary for me. BD won and I'm happy that there is now a single format. If HD-DVD had I would have bought that format. Just get over the fact that "your" format didn't win and enjoy the films in HD splendor.
Happy BD Owner
Contrary to your claims I 'got over' HD DVD losing the format war long long ago.
I was helped in large part by the enormous number of incredible cheap HD DVD movies and players I was able to get
(so no, I'm not in the least but concerned about accidents or unlikely equipment breakdowns).
Thanks to HD DVD's demise I was able to quickly built a very nice collection of 1080p goodness at a very very low price.
It's simply true that those with experience of both formats from day 1 know HD DVDs HDi was and is far more consumer-friendly than Blu-ray's Java.
The visual image is identical and you need incredibly expensive high-end audio kit (including a very good 5.1/7.1 speaker package) to honestly seperate the minor difference between Dolby Digital+ and lossless audio.
I am fortunate enough to have all of that and yes, I do enjoy my HD movies.
I remain far from convinced that Blu-ray will genuinely grow enough and fast enough to last beyond the next 5 years.
Personally I can afford formats coming and going but like anyone else I find it a real PITA.
It's no secret that my view is that the wrong format won but why I think that is relevant is because of that we are doomed to go through this all again in a much shortened time-scale than we would have had the other been the successful format.
Water under the bridge of course but that's my view.
So shoot me for it. :¬P
HDi isn't more "consumer friendly". Consumers DON'T CARE whether their interactive experience is supplied by an XML based menu system, a binary based menu system like HDMV, or by BD-J. It's an implementation detail. As long as it works (and all of them do) then it doesn't matter provided the implementation satisfies the requirements.
Even most content authors don't care much unless they're trying to do a game or some other non-standard feature. Authors live inside tools like Sonic Scenarist and drag and drop their user interfaces through a GUI which the tool generates into the deployable format. But if they did need to hit the metal then BD-J is a superset of the functionality of HDi and therefore allows them to do more anyway, games being a case in point but extending to any kind of interactive application on disc or in firmware such as streaming apps.
It really is stupid to be beating a drum for a dead format anyway. Microsoft and Toshiba have moved on so why can't you?
Interesting indeed.. I wonder if the fact that CBHD is a huge success in China had some influence on this. Now they can offer Blu-ray players while they are making the killing from HD DVD in China.
Now, let's see BD-XA2!
Wow, CBHD being a "huge" success. A government sponsored format in a communist dictatorship.
The old HD-DVD fans are relly grasping for straws now. How pathetic!
I don't think CBHD has much to do with it, whatever royalties they're getting from CBHD (and I recall reading they sold the rights or something, though I can't remember the exact details) would be coming in anyway regardless of whether they go into BD.
Toshiba thought BD was going to grow much more slowly than it did, and online and flash-format technologies would take off in a way they didn't. Unfortunately, the parts of HD DVD that were supposed to make the latter happen just weren't adopted by the industry contrary to many expectations (only Microsoft has built anything upon them, and it's still limited to X-Box 360 movie rental viewing only)
So for now, Toshiba is going to put out a handful of me-too devices while it waits for something more concrete to happen.
Would love a new dual format player from Toshiba to make sure I can keep playing all my HDDVD's for a long time :) Would go nicely with my LG BH200, but I guess that will probably not happen.
I agree, a more up-to-date dual player would be very nice (even though, following the profile 2.0 update the LG BH200 is an excellent player).
But sadly I also agree it's unlikely in the extreme.
The only real question (which surprisingly no-one here seems to be asking) is whether Toshiba buy in a cheap Blu-ray player and rebadge or do they take the more costly premium route and release a new high-spec player all of their own?
The answer to this will tell us much more about how they see things going.
CBHD is not Toshiba. They have sold licences to let the Chinese gov develop their own standard which is apparently not even compatible with HD DVD.
Just like CD-V & co before it, the CBHD will be plagued with pirated copies (as the BR format already is in China), and unlikely to have -any- sort of mipact anywhere outside China.
Tech differences aside, you can't be a consumer electronics company - a business dedicated to the craft of bigger better faster more - without an HD media platform. This had to happen. I can't believe it was ever a debate or doubted.
Sign me up! I just hope it matches my HD-A3
I might have an HDTV by Christmas, Toshiba's Blu-Ray player might be a good buy.