DirecTV, Cisco and Samsung have whole house DVR plans with RVU alliance
By Ben Drawbaugh 
posted Aug 19th 2009 12:00PM
posted Aug 19th 2009 12:00PM
Here's how it would work
The concept is that you'd get a RVU server from your content provider (like DirecTV but it could also be cable or anyone else) and plug it into your home network. Then you'd buy HDTVs from the likes of Samsung with a RVU client built in, or you could even plug the RVU server directly into the TV. Then you can go to any TV in your house that is also an RVU client and access the exact same experience. This experience includes the ability to watch or record the same shows that you can from any other TV. Now the key part that get our minds going is the fact that Samsung obviously wants to sell TVs with this built in, otherwise why join the alliance? And then there is Cisco and DirecTV, both companies that make DVRs. So obviously they have interest in creating an RVU server. So as you can see this concept holds some real of potential.
What we don't know
Of course the website is short on details, which leads us to believe the details haven't been finalized yet. First up on our list of q's is how scalable is it? In other words, how many tuners can we have in the house, how much disc space is supported, and how many clients can there be? But we also wonder if you can have multiple servers from different providers on the same network? Then there is the biggest question of all, which is how well will this actually work -- assuming it even makes it to market. The last question isn't a cocern if you have DirecTV, but if you have cable, we wonder if your provider would even offer such a box, assuming Cisco actually makes a server? Of course not everyone wants to buy a Samsung TV, so we wonder how likely it is that other manufactures would join in on the party? Or what about other devices? The press release mentions other digital media adapters and set-top-boxes, so who knows how widespread the support for this could be.
Built on the shoulders of DLNA an UPnP
One of the most promising aspects of the RVU alliance is the fact that it is built on top of DLNA and UPnP. These two technologies are really everywhere, from Windows 7 to the Playstation 3. In fact we'd be willing to bet that DLNA is the most widespread media alliance ever assembled. A quick look at the roster on the DLNA site shows how well adopted it is. Of course neither DLNA, nor UPnP have the features required to deliver the type of experience that the RVU alliance is promising, which is where the new alliance comes in. To make up the difference, the RVU is offering the RUI -- you saw that one coming right -- which is described as a pixel accurate remote user interface technology. Basically the server would deliver the user interface alongside the video and audio to the client, which means all the heavy lifting is done on the server rather than the client. This is supposed to make the client less expensive and easier to implement, but it also means not just any DLNA client will work.
Okay, sounds great, but when?
According to our old friend Rômulo Pontual, DIRECTV's chief technology officer, "We are committed to the RVU technology and are planning to deploy it in media servers and clients beginning early in 2010." That sounds great and all, but DirecTV doesn't exactly have the best track record of delivering new technologies on time. Of course just because DirecTV has a server and clients out next year, doesn't mean Samsung or any other TV will, but at least it is a start.
It sounds great on paper, but we want to check it out first hand
If there is one thing we've learned following the HD industry, it is that plenty of great ideas go wrong when implemented. We all know too well that you can't buy electronics based on the spec sheet alone, so as great as this sounds, we won't be ditching our Windows Media Center setup just yet. One thing is for sure though, the RVU alliance most certainly has our attention, we just hope that they can deliver.
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What about U-verse? They recently rolled out THDVR (Total Home DVR). With this you can View, Record and Play any show from any room on up to 8 receivers.
The drawback is you only get one DVR and the other seven get all the DVR programs and the recorded programs to the main DVR.
Other thing is you can only pause "live" tv on the main DVR.
Not perfect but something better then Dish or Directv in terms of having all DVR programs throughout the house.
How big is the hard drive (including possible external?) and how many shows can it record at once? If the answer isn't at least 1TB and 4 tuners, then it is useless.
I believe it's 320gb and it can record up to 4 shows (4 tuners).
They should have external hard drive capability in the next few months.
Currently they are releasing Media Share to the subscribers.
Got Uverse and dumped after three weeks. That tuner limitation was such a step down from multi-room DirecTV DVRs. There are plenty of times when my family records more than four shows on different channels simultaneously and the UVerse simply wouldn't let you watch any other channels without forcing a tuner in another room to shut down.
And they were just rolling out the ability to record from rooms other than where the DVR lived. Still couldn't schedule future recordings. .
It had a nice interface and the benefit of video on demand, but it was a pretty easy decision to go back to satellite.
4 tuners, up to 2 of them can be for HD content. Feed the whole house, even HD recordings to SDTVs (downsampled to SD).
They dropped a Media Center tuner for..................THIS?!
Are you kidding me?
Samsung: Just give me a TV with an extender built in.
no doubt. I recently got an HDPVR thanks to Ben and his post about DVBLogic. Now I have my HD DirecTV up and running within Media Center. So far no issues and no power cycles needed as I have disabled standby on the HDPVR. All good for 3 weeks straight. So I no longer have to wait for the Media Center Tuner. It absolutely kicks ass. Nothing like HD DirecTV right in my Media Center with the 3 360's in the house.
---I recently got an HDPVR thanks to Ben and his post about DVBLogic. Now I have my HD DirecTV up and running within Media Center. ---
Hi FNG, can you pls point me to the set up instructions on this? Where did you find a HD tuner card for DirecTV?
Thanks!
Hi Jacan. To be clear, it's not a card. It's an external box. The HDPVR allows you to connect your set top box via component and also optical for 5.1. DVBLink for HDPVR is the software used to allow you to add the HDPVR and what ever set top box you have as a tuner within Media Center. Full DirecTV guide data is also present within Media Center.
I bought my HDPVR from newegg for ~$200. DVBLink for HDPVR is software that is $30 from http://dvblogic.com/ I didn't buy the software yet as it has a 30 day trial and I'm hoping Media Center will have a native HDPVR driver soon. See Ben's article about Media Center predictions.
http://www.engadgethd.com/2009/08/10/cedia-2009-windows-media-center-predictions/
If you have any other questions, please ask.
@FNG - I have been trying to figure out a way to connect my Windows Media Center PC to my DirecTV for, well, for forever. It sounds like you're doing with the DVBLogic software. I'm going to check them out right now and see what I can learn that will help me do it too. A couple quick questions: What is the brand and model of HDPVR that you bought from newegg? Does everything work through the Media Center software when you are using it or do you have to jump back out to other software to do certain things. Obviously once its all setup I don't want to have to leave the Media Center interface in order to watch stuff.
Thanks for the info.
Cheers,
Tony
Tony, the HDPVR is from Hauppauge.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16815116030&Tpk=hdpvr
It acts just like a regular tuner when used with DVBLink for HDPVR from DVBLogic. No need to exit Media Center or anything. You must have Windows 7 or a hacked h.264 driver and the TV pack installed if you are using Vista. I really would advise against the Vista route. Although I used TV pack since the day it was leaked, it really isn't for the novice. I think most of this info is on the forums and download page over at dvblogic.
I'm running Windows 7 RTM and using the rearm trick until Oct 22nd to keep it alive. I was using RC but thought why not try the final build...
Do you use Media Center now?
Assuming DirecTV and TiVo are really working on a new box (DirectTiVo), I am curious as to how this would fit together. I have been rather hopeful (and ready to be let down), that TiVo would have a new box with cooperative scheduling and better 'sharing' capabilities. Though I suspect we will not see this new thing for some time to come. Think Tru2way...
And then there is the issue of streaming HD bandwidth around your network to each RVU client, which means gigabit network cabling at least, no wireless. Also, can you buy movies and store them on say a windows home server, which is what the first home network element above sort of looks like, or store TV shows on the home server if you start running out of disk space on the RVU server. I would assume any DRM is dealt with by the RVU server. And hopefully the RVU server is powerful enough to handle all of the streaming.
Gigabit is certainly not required.
The maximum transfer rate of Blu-Ray is 53.95 Mbit/s. And DirecTV compresses more. DirecTV's HD channels don't take more than 20 Mbit/s to stream in their native codec.
Of course they could just get the media center tuner out and have it already.
Is THIS what cancelled that project? if so I say BOOOO
I am trying out a DirecTV app that allows streaming of my recorded programs to my pc with a few caveats - must be at home connected to my network. It has a few snags, but when it works, is great. Its a Beta app and perhaps the 1st step in achieving some sort of whole-house entertainment offering from DirecTV
what app is that? i'm interested...
http://www.directv.com/DTVAPP/global/contentPageNR.jsp?assetId=P4920044
DirecTV already offers multi-room viewing from a central DVR via beta releases. They don't need to partner with anyone. I'm using it right now.
So you have access to the same HD on any TV in your house and you only have ONE DirecTV box in the whole house? I doubt it. The partners make it so we don't need boxes at every TV anymore. Not to mention, are you actually arguing that being open to 3rd party devices is a bad thing?
1. Yes. I have access to the recording on one DVR from elsewhere in my home Cutting Edge beta software development program that is done hand-in-hand with DirecTV and is available to anyone.
2. No, I am not arguing against 3rd party devices. I'm saying it is possible today and partnering with someone else is necessary in this case.
So DirecTV makes beta software for your TV?? You are actually trying to tell me that you are watching HD on another TV without having a DirecTV box at that TV?
Here you go Ben: http://www.satelliteguys.us/directv-cutting-edge-ce-discussion-forum/149732-directv-cutting-edge-program-terms-faq-how-hidden-features-more.html
Are you ignoring my question on purpose or do you just always only read half of what is written?
Does this, or does this not require a DirecTV STB at every TV you want to watch HD on?
And for all you know, what you are using is built on this RVU technology.
@Ben you are right. @Roger - you still need a client.
MRV is enabled, however you do need a 'MRV client' which can be another HD DVR or HD receiver that is running the right software. You require the box on the other TV. A lot like being able to watch the content on your PC with DIRECTV2PC software. So no, there is no magical enablement without the HD receiver.
Before I answer your remaining questions...I have a question for you: Why do you feel the need to be such a dick? You sure aren't being very professional. If you are choosing to report on something like this...you probably should have been aware of this feature from DirecTV. A little research never hurt. I didn't attack you or your story. I simply said that it is a service that is already available without additional parties being involved. No reason to get so defensive just because you weren't aware of the Cutting Edge program.
You drove me to my attitude by ignoring my question. I was trying to get your attention and it worked.
The cutting edge program might as well not exist as it isn't available to the average person. I was aware that DirecTV did these types of programs, just not the MRV one specifically. Besides, it still isn't the same thing, as I wouldn't consider using the existing implementation with boxes at every TV, but I would use this one if it meant I didn't need a box (assuming the UI was better than the HR21's)
Ben...you're an idiot. The CE program is available to anyone with a current receiver and the ability to read. It isn't private. You don't have to be invited. You just do it. You reset the receiver and input a very small code...you're done. Is that too much to ask?
Might as well not exist? How the hell do you think new software releases are being tested and improved. If you use DirecTV and benefit from new and/or improved features...they are a direct result of the CE beta program.
No need to call people names, I don't have a problem deleting comments.
First you have to know is even exists, then you have to seek it out, bottom line is that it isn't a feature that people haven't heard of DBStalk would know about.
Sorry engadget, I have this functionality with a MythTV backend server and 4 diskless clients today.
So dream on dudes!!
Media portal also does this for Windows, and is freeware too. Rev2.0 should have a GUI on a par with MCE. Watch out MS, your days are numbered unless you release softsled pronto.
I too have U-verse Total Home DVR, and it is great. I often start watching a recorded show in the living room only to get kicked out (by my daughter) but I then get finish the show in the game room. All seamless and easy.
is there a cost to the Cutting Edge software you mention?
It is free
Check out the "Cutting Edge" Forum @ dbstalk.com
I'm also already doing whole-house DVR via SageTV server, two HD-PVRs, and two Sage extenders (TV source is Dish network btw). Had some past headaches with HD-PVR lockups but working flawlessly for months now.
Great to see some other choices may be out there, although I'm skeptical on the timing and quality of initial offerings. I'll probably stick to Sage regardless because I can also play all of my movies, home videos and see all of my pictures whole house, which you won't be able to do with these other options (at least as well, as Sage file format support can't beat).
Could you tell me more details on how you do this exactly? Is there a detailed writeup? I have 4 DISH Network VIP622 DVRs and I am trying to figure out how to get "whole house DVR" with Dish Network. I would like to keep all 4 tuners because there are 7 people living in house and we have Tvs all over the place. All the VIP622s are located in the headend basement location. We have whole house component video and a video matrix switch.
@Ben you are correct. You need a HD receiver or HD DVR at the other TV to view the content. That receiver also has to have the feature enabled on it. A lot like the DIRECTV2PC software.
@Roger sorry mate, you gotta have the STB.
hopefully this solution will allow more than 50 series recordings like the Directv DVRs are currently limited to.
@Ben you are correct. You need a HD receiver or HD DVR at the other TV to view the content. That receiver also has to have the feature enabled on it. A lot like the DIRECTV2PC software.
I'm sure you are aware of the details, but the cutting edge forum on dbstalk.com has more info.
wth Reply!!!
Yeah, the comment system for all of these sites on Weblogs, Inc. needs to be scrapped. It is the most buggy, finnicky thing I think I have ever used. I don't know if it's just not designed to work on either Firefox or Internet Explorer, but it usually takes me at least three or four attempts at posting before it "sticks." I'm very much in the habit of copying my entire comment before I hit submit so that I can simply paste it back in the comment box when it doesn't work and I have to do it again.
I can tell you that it never goes through the first time.
Also, I sometimes get the message that an email has been sent and I have to go and verify it... as if I'm commenting for the first time. on the site (even though I've entered my email address and password).
I honestly can't believe it hasn't been scrapped or fixed yet. I've seen people complaining about it for a very long time.
That was a first! That last comment, where I spent the most time complaining about how it doesn't work and never goes through on the first try... actually went through on the first try. (Maybe there's a buzzword that allowed it to go through correctly.)
I think the Netgear router in the picture associated with the Cisco product is a nice touch.
I love the idea of a headless DVR being stored away in a central location. However, amongst a number of other factors that will have to come together, a key one I see is that this will only become widely adopted if the client can be bought as an inexpensive component (i.e. an extender). That's cool if Samsung were to build it into their TV's as a convenience factor, but I highly doubt many people are going to invest a lot of money buying new TV's just for this capability. The cost and risks are too high. Thus the ecosystem of products will need to include a low-cost (about $99 would be right) client that provides the full UI experience.
If this turns out to be another closed ecosystem with only a few product options, I'm definitely skipping it. Let's hope the use of DLNA and UPnP standards keeps it open enough to be useful with other products.
DIRECTV will provide clients (tunerless HD box) and also build it into TVs so you wont need a new TV to make this work.
I also look forward to such a development..., but your history needs a bit of correction.
The 5000 series ReplayTV DVR's were capable of doing this 6 years ago. Back in 2003 I had a 5xxx series in the bedroom as well as a 5xxx series Replay unit in the Theater. You could record from either location to either DVR and you could watch anything stored on either DVR in either location.
In addition the Replay system treated your PC like another DVR where you could watch content stored on the DVR's or you could set up your PC to offload content from the DVR's at night and store it on the larger hard-drive in your PC. If you did this you could also see the PC from either DVR and access the stored content for display in any location where you had a PC or a ReplayTV DVR.
It was a pity that Replay was never able to get a large enough public following as they did have the more robust software.
I wish ReplayTV was still around. Even the 4000 series had multi-room viewing close to ten years ago.
Folks, this is not just "multi room viewing"
It allows a TV running the software layer to change channels and view life content from the VRU server (in addition to viewing recorded program). It does not require another box per se, just the VRU software layer. That can be incorporated into a number of network appliances. So yes, it does multi-room viewing, but a whole lot more. So let's cut down on the "when I was a kid we had this system that would do this" junk for now - it's not the same.