http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/ Engadget Comments for http://www.engadget.com/media/feedlogo.gif http://www.engadget.com en-us Copyright 2012 Weblogs, Inc. The contents of this feed are available for non-commercial use only. Blogsmith http://www.blogsmith.com/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/Jun 30th 2010 11:07AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/
Eeeew, that thing looks like a robot worm sticking out, seriously.]]>Jun 30th 2010 11:08AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/
Technically HDMI 1.3 can carry 3D, but devices that are HDMI 1.3 certified might not support 3D. So if a device wants to be HDMI 1.4a certified, it has to be 3D aware. In addition to 3D though, HDMI 1.4 also supports ethernet as well as an audio return channel.]]>Jun 30th 2010 11:14AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/Jun 30th 2010 11:42AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/Jun 30th 2010 12:04PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/
Ethernet Channel
Audio Return Channel
4k × 2k Resolution Support

It also officially adds 3D support but 3D runs fine through 1.3 as well.]]>Jun 30th 2010 12:09PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/"And you won't get full 1080p 3D via an upgraded HDMI 1.3 box, either — just half or quarter resolution, depending on the source. HDMI 1.3 isn't powerful enough to stream near-simultaneous 1080p frames. From a full 1080p source such as Blu-ray or a satellite receiver, you'll instead get dual 1080i images to create 3D; from a cable box, you'll get dual 540i images. I've been told the difference between full 1080p 3D and 540i 3D is essentially the difference between Blu-ray and DVD, which for most people is not that big of a difference."

http://dvice.com/archives/2009/12/no-new-blu-ray.php]]>Jun 30th 2010 1:00PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/
That article is incorrect. The highest quality 3D available today is 1080p24 per eye which actually uses less bandwidth than 1080p60. So HDMI 1.3 has more than enough throughput for 1080p24 Full 3D, but the equipment just doesn't understand the way the data is packed in.

In fact Sony 3D Blu-ray players and the PS3 both have HDMI 1.3 interfaces and work with Blu-ray's full 3D.]]>Jun 30th 2010 2:09PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/Jun 30th 2010 2:21PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/of course...maybe i'm just whistling dixie out my ass.]]>Jun 30th 2010 11:18AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/The problem with an all in one TV like what you described is "What happens to the entire set when one item goes out?" The cost of repairing something like that could easily outweigh the cost of buying a new one, creating a lot more electronic waste that we don't need right now.

Also, a TV that had all of those things in it definitely wouldn't be the beautifully 1/2" slim TVs that everyone lusts over now. You'd have to have a built in amp with 7.1 outputs and 100W per channel. You'd need a cable card / tru2way slot, you'd need the space for a 500GB HDD.... plus the controllers and decoders, plus the LCD, plus a mega large power supply to power it all, and I'm sure a whole list of other things I can't even begin to think of at the moment.]]>Jun 30th 2010 11:25AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/Jun 30th 2010 12:10PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/
We still prefer to do as much as possible over RS-232, even though it's an older control scheme. The programming for it is much easier than IP, has the needed 2-way communication (metadata, status data, etc.) and is very much proven to not have the same problems as other control mechanisms.

IP control of products is still relatively new (compared to 232) but it does work... most of the time. I know one of my receivers is plagued with a problem with when it's not being used often enough it stops receiving the 'power on' command over IP. IP also gives you nice 2-way feedback with metadata and all that jazz. IP will eventually replace 232, but it's not quite there yet.

IR, oh IR.... As long as you have a component that has discrete commands, IR is fine. It's when you run into a TV that uses toggle power commands and non-discrete video switching that the problems come in. Sony, Samsung, Sharp all use discrete IR codes and I love them for it.

HDMI... Oh, how I hate thee. We don't use HDMI for control at all, and probably won't unless the the world ends and the lawyers demand we do so.

Thanks for doing the write up Ben, it was a good read (even if I do disagree on a few minor points)]]>Jun 30th 2010 11:20AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/I spent several years programming MX-3000 remotes from IR. I hate the stupid TOAD commands and anything non-RS-232. IR is just so janky and has no meta-data.

Just curious, how did you get started as a CI/Control Systems Integrator?]]>Jun 30th 2010 7:50PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/
Sort of fell into it 4 years. Been doing it ever since. I don't do a lot of the 232/IP programming ( I work with our lead programmer, he programs, I connect it all ), but I do know that 232 is the only control style that we never seem to have problems with. ]]>Jun 30th 2010 9:58PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/Jun 30th 2010 11:26AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/
Programmable remotes would be its own post. And nothing reliable about a Harmony. If it was it wouldn't need the stupid help menu.]]>Jun 30th 2010 11:32AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/Jun 30th 2010 11:33AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/
He didn't specifically mention the harmony remote, but he did mention universal remotes in general. The Harmony's have gotten better with their PC programming, but (in my opinion) are no better or worse than any other high end universal remote.]]>Jun 30th 2010 11:39AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/Jun 30th 2010 11:40AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/Jun 30th 2010 12:01PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/
Universal Remote, Model MX-850 or MX-900]]>Jun 30th 2010 12:17PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/
The article (unless is has been edited after my post) makes no mention of universal remotes. It says that "IR is universal", which is not the same thing. But enough with the semantics...]]>Jun 30th 2010 12:30PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/
To each their own. You get what you pay for, and you get a lot for your money with a harmony remote. I never tried to compare it to a "professional" installer only system. Why did you? Just because a BMW is a nicer car that a Volkswagen, that doesn't mean the VW is crap. ]]>Jun 30th 2010 12:35PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/
Just because I'm a stickler:

"This means that while you can buy a programmable remote to control everything in your rack."

he used programmable in place of universal, but the meaning is implied and since there is an actual company called "Universal Remote" he may have been trying to not confuse people ]]>Jun 30th 2010 12:47PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/Jun 30th 2010 8:41PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/Jun 30th 2010 8:48PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/
Maybe you are correct. I have no experience with the URC remotes, so I really can't comment on that. I do have experience with the harmony remotes, and if you are insinuating that they are the 'yugo' in your comparison, then we'll just have to agree to disagree about that. When my 74 year old father in law comes over and goes into my home theater, he can pick up the harmony remote and touch the button next to "watch TV' on the screen, and that is all he has to do besides change the channel. It is brain-dead simple for someone unfamiliar with my gear to use it. Same thing with "watch disc" or "watch HTPC", or "play XBOX" One button and everything is done for them, except physically putting a disc in the blu-ray player. I get it that since Logitech bought the harmony brand it has become a more retail product, and maybe lost favor with the audio/videophile elitists because of that. As a linux user and a software developer, I dislike the windows only hand-holding programming interface. But the fact that my wife, my father-in-law, and my young children can actually use it without my help has won me over. If you can honestly tell me that a URC remote, or some other brand will give my family the same experience and have additional benefits/features, then I'll look into it for my next remote.]]>Jul 1st 2010 12:59AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/Being a Linux guy myself, I despise having to keep a VM running just to program remotes for customers. If you like the wizard based approach that Harmony takes, URC actually has a remote that runs a wizard on its screen, so you can program it computer free.
Harmony didn't invent the activity based macro, they were just the first to hang on a peg hook at Best Buy. The major disadvantage with Harmony is the inability to grow past what they are capable of out of the box.
I don't want to come off as a hater, I just want people to know their are plenty of options that offer value besides Harmony.]]>Jul 1st 2010 11:20AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/Jun 30th 2010 11:26AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/
Yeah BT would've been a decent addition. The problem is that it is really only the PS3 that uses it. Not even Sony TVs use it.]]>Jun 30th 2010 11:33AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://github.com/oneman/FiosRemote]]>Jun 30th 2010 11:27AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/Jun 30th 2010 11:29AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/Jun 30th 2010 12:12PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/Anynet+->setup. You can then turn CEC completely off or just change it so the tv doesn't automatically turn off when the bd is shut off. At least that's the process on my 2-3 year old Samsung, and I'm guessing the menu hasn't changed too much. I use my PS3 as a bd so I'm not sure the process for changing that, but it shouldn't matter if you do it directly in the tv. ]]>Jun 30th 2010 1:17PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/
The best solution for me is a harmony remote. You can define each button on the remote for different devices. So set volume controls to your a/v receiver, channel numbers to your cable/satellite box... Then macros to turn everything on all in one.]]>Jun 30th 2010 11:30AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/Jun 30th 2010 11:31AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/
By law, WiFi is required to accept any unwanted interference even if it affects the intended operation. Personally, I don't want to have my stereo cranked only to get a blast of static that blows out my speakers. Wired is always more reliable, period.]]>Jun 30th 2010 11:46AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/
Still, I ain't gonna argue, wired is the better way.]]>Jun 30th 2010 9:59PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/Jul 2nd 2010 3:36PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/
So my question: Is it the same thing, and the "CEC" portion is just usually cut off when discussing the standard, or is HDMI-CEC a specific version of HDMI that allows more functionality?]]>Jun 30th 2010 11:33AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HDMI#CEC CEC is part of HDMI it's not always implemented making it less useful as you can't be sure all your hardware will allow it. Unless you research lots before you purchase.]]>Jun 30th 2010 11:38AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/
HDMI-CEC is the control protocol that runs over HDMI cables. It is part of the spec, but not a requirement and implementors have flexibility to add in their own control signals. But the basic discovery and addressing is standard. It isn't very user configurable and is very device specific, so it will really depend on which hardware you have.]]>Jun 30th 2010 11:47AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/Just bought a decent home theater system, new HDTV, HD cable and hooked up the HTPC that I've been building for a while. I have all the content I want, but it takes 3 remotes and keyboard and mouse to control everything. Each remote has some universal options, so I can control volume with one, or change the channel with the other and stuff like that. But if I want to change from movie to game mode on the tv, I need to tv remote, if I want to change from Dolby to DTS I need the receiver remote, want to control the dvr, need the cable remote. Want to watch online content, need the keyboard and mouse. It's just tooooooooo much.
I thought about a logitech harmony, but those are too dang expensive, I don't know if they could even really do everything I need to do.
You know what would be great. A little box I could strap under my coffee table that I could program each function for each device into and control from a touch screen keyboard that could also interface wirelessly with my computer. If it existed, I could not afford it, but I can dream.


Sorry for the rant.]]>Jun 30th 2010 11:40AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/
If you want to dream, check out Control 4. They do exactly what you want, but you will still need the KB and Mouse for the HTPC for any control option out there.]]>Jun 30th 2010 11:54AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/
Take your time thinking what you need the buttons to do and make use of the lcd section for less commonly needed buttons on the remote.

As for the mouse and keyboard, if you are using media centre or similar there are plugins to add online content such as youtube, iPlayer and hulu direct into the menus, then you have an ir receiver on your htpc.]]>Jun 30th 2010 11:58AMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.globalcache.com/products/gc-100/]]>Jun 30th 2010 12:05PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/Jun 30th 2010 1:18PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/
Yeah, 'cuz that 4 foot walk to the TV and back is going to really help people loose 100lbs.

What about people who have distributed Audio/Video systems, should they walk down to their rack and turn everything on, then walk back and forth to change channels and volume?]]>Jun 30th 2010 2:14PMhttp://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/30/hd-101-ir-blasters-hdmi-cec-rs-232-and-ip-control/Jun 30th 2010 3:14PM